On Wednesday, April 22, 2020 at 6:09:43 PM UTC-6, Lawrence Crowell wrote: > > On Wednesday, April 22, 2020 at 3:48:24 PM UTC-5, Alan Grayson wrote: >> >> >> >> On Wednesday, April 22, 2020 at 2:39:45 PM UTC-6, Alan Grayson wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> On Wednesday, April 22, 2020 at 10:19:52 AM UTC-6, Lawrence Crowell >>> wrote: >>>> >>>> On Wednesday, April 22, 2020 at 8:21:30 AM UTC-5, Alan Grayson wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Wednesday, April 22, 2020 at 5:22:23 AM UTC-6, John Clark wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> On Wed, Apr 22, 2020 at 1:39 AM Alan Grayson <[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> > Could it be the case that Casimir plates attract each other due to >>>>>>> electrostatic forces and not vacuum energy? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Of course not! Don't you thing getting rid of electrostatic forces >>>>>> would be the very first thing any even halfway competent experimental >>>>>> scientists would think of before he even dreamed of performing such a >>>>>> super >>>>>> delicate experiment? >>>>>> >>>>>> John K Clark >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Experiments done on the space shuttle and in Germany (where free fall >>>>> is simulated) have shown that dust particles accumulate due to >>>>> electrostatic forces, thus changing the model for how planets formed. And >>>>> if you read the excerpt from the Wiki article I posted, MIT physicists, >>>>> in >>>>> 1997 IIRC, were able to explain the Casimir effect without appealing to >>>>> vacuum energy. AG >>>>> >>>> >>>> If the two Casimir plates are grounded there will be no electrostatic >>>> potential between them. Elementary electricity. >>>> >>>> LC >>>> >>> >>> I'm not sure how the MIT physicist did the experiment. I just know the >>> claim; that he accounted for the forces on the plates without need of >>> appealing to vacuum energy. I'll see if I can find the paper and post it. >>> AG >>> >> >> Try this, by another physicist: >> Proof that Casimir force does not originate from vacuum energy >> https://arxiv.org/abs/1605.04143 AG >> > > There has to be something wrong. For one he says the EM Hamiltonian > commutes with the matter Hamiltonian, and so there is no interaction > between the EM field and matter. This would be the case if the matter > possesses no charges. There can be two Hamiltonians that commute with each > other, and it is the case the two sectors are independent. However, there > is the interaction H_i = ∫d^4x j*A that the two operators separately do not > have involution with. This is where the interaction happens. So I have > suspicions about this claim. > > LC >
Then try this: The Casimir Effect and the Quantum Vacuum https://arxiv.org/abs/hep-th/0503158 AG -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/26730618-6af1-44a5-acf2-79e8bba3230e%40googlegroups.com.
