On Monday, May 18, 2020 at 6:52:30 AM UTC-5, Bruno Marchal wrote: > > > On 15 May 2020, at 21:12, Philip Thrift <[email protected] <javascript:>> > wrote: > > > > On Friday, May 15, 2020 at 11:08:44 AM UTC-5, Bruno Marchal wrote: >> >> >> On 14 May 2020, at 12:09, Philip Thrift <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> This is true! >> >> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Laundry_Files >> >> "Magic <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magic_(paranormal)>" is described >> as being a branch of applied computation (mathematics), therefore computers >> and equations are just as useful, and perhaps more potent, than classic >> spellbooks, pentagrams, and sigils for the purpose of influencing ancient >> powers and opening gates to other dimensions. >> >> >> >> >> I don’t believe in “real magic”. If time travel was possible and a >> time-traveller comes back with a documentary showing Jesus making water >> into wine, I would still consider that the most plausible explanation would >> be that Jesus is a good prestidigitator. >> >> Why? Just by considering the degree of credulity of the humans, and their >> craft in prestidigitation. >> >> Similarly, I find far more reasonable, even “Occam-reasonable” that the >> appearance of a physical universe is due to number’s prestidigitation, >> because incompleteness shows the numbers being both terribly naïve, but >> also incredibly gifted in the art of making their fellow number believing >> almost everything. Gödel’s theorem warned us; if we are consistent, it is >> even consistent that we are inconsistent (<>t -> <>[]f). >> >> Computationalism is Prestidigitalism. Lol. >> >> Wolfram is correct about “[]p”, but forget completely []p & p (and thus >> missed physics, theology, etc.) >> >> At least Penrose is aware of the abyssal difference between “[]p” and >> “[]p & p”, but literally confusse them in its use of Gödel’s incompleteness >> against Mechanism. >> >> So, with respect to metaphysics and to the Mind-Body problem in the frame >> of Descartes-Darwin Mechanism, we can say that Penrose is less wrong than >> Wolfram, and more interestingly-wrong. >> >> I am not claiming that Penrose or Wolfram are wrong. I am just comparing >> them with the canonical theology of the universal machine, that is, with >> the 8 modes of self-truth/belief/knowledge/observation/sensation of the >> universal machine having enough induction beliefs/axioms, in any hard or >> soft relative implementation. >> >> Those modes can be motivated through Mechanist thought experiments and/or >> through the Theaetetus of Plato. >> >> Bruno >> >> >> >> >> > > Wolfram thinks that his H*ypergraphic Universe Modeling (HUM) language* > can lead to a unified QM+GR theory. > > Do you think consciousness is needed for this unification? > > > Not necessarily, in the sense that it is still possible to conceive a > theory of "everything physical” which would be logically independent of a > theory of consciousness, as far as we are interested in predicting first > person plural observation. > > But such a theory would be cut from reality, as it would not be able to > explain why our consciousness satisfies those prediction, so it would not > be a theory of everything. > > To get that theory of everything including mind and consciousness, there > are two options: a mechanist theory of mind, or a non mechanist theory of > mind. With a mechanist theory, you will need to derive the “theory of > everything-physical” from arithmetic. I don’t see any other way to get a > theory of consciousness adequate with the physical observation. > With a non-mechanist theory of mind, everything remains open, if only > because such a theory of mind does not exist (except in faith tales). > > Bruno > > The get a theory of consciousness (or experience), one starts with a "sixth" force/field, allowing for the other five - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fifth_force- around now.
It's nature would be "localized" in a way different from the other five (or four). And no one knows what gravity - for example - really is either, aside from some mathematical formulas - we invented - matching its "behavior". @philipthrift -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/3b9fa6a6-0e35-4581-8390-52fcd2cefc7d%40googlegroups.com.
