On 7/24/2020 3:49 AM, Alan Grayson wrote:
On Friday, July 24, 2020 at 4:38:20 AM UTC-6, Lawrence Crowell wrote:
On Thursday, July 23, 2020 at 10:03:36 PM UTC-5
[email protected] wrote:
If such a theory could be constructed, it would have particles
to manifest excited states, called gravitons. But for a BH,
gravitons generated by its mass couldn't escape, so they
couldn't function as force carrying particles as in other
quantum field theories. We'd still need Einstein's GR to
account for the gravitational "force" via curvature of
space-time. So what would a quantum theory of gravity buy us?
Why do we need it? AG
The way you state this illustrates considerable confusion and in
these threads I and others have indicated how to think of this.
This does not involve gravitons coming out of black holes. You
have repeated this error a number of times.
You previously stated that gravitons cannot escape BH's. Do you stand
by this claim? AG
Of course that's true. If a double neutron star, which would be a
source of gravitational radiation, fell into a super-massive black hole,
its gravitational radiation would go futureward into the "singularity",
not out.
But gravitons are the linearized infinitesimal wave solutions of
gravitational perturbation. The mass of the neutron double star would
still add to the mass of the black hole and expand its event horizon.
From the standpoint of a distant observer, the gravitational effect of
the (double star + black hole) is the same whether the former is inside
the latter or just nearby.
Brent
A weak low energy quantum gravitation is easy to derive. The low
energy limit of gravitation is linear because terms in the
curvature involving the square of connection terms are much
smaller. This makes gravitation and gravitational waves linear.
Quantization is not much different from quantizing electrodynamics
in QED. The gravitational waves detected by the LIGO are long
wavelength and with small amplitude. There should be signatures of
gravitons there which would be linear. As the wavelength shortens
the energy increases and as this approaches TeV and higher energy
the nonlinear terms become appreciable. The nonlinear feature of
gravitation, and that it is an exterior fibration so the field
correlates direction with the quantum wave, means this is a
nonlinear quantum mechanics, which is a contradiction of quantum
mechanics.
LC
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