Stathis Papaioannou

On Wed, 24 Jan 2024 at 17:26, Brent Meeker <> wrote:

> On 1/23/2024 9:34 PM, Stathis Papaioannou wrote:
> here is yet another level, phenomenal consciousness, which has no
>>> behavioural manifestations whatsoever, allowing for the theoretical
>>> possibility of philosophical zombies. Some claim that phenomenal
>>> consciousness reduces to one of the other kinds, and therefore that zombies
>>> are impossible.
>>> That's the kind that couldn't evolve and so I agree with JC that it's
>>> unlikely to exist.
>> Apparently it does exist, but it appears that it is epiphenomenal.
>> It's far from apparent to me.  Why do you think it exists?
> It exists because I know it does, and I would guess that you know it does
> as well. I can’t do anything to demonstrate it, because that is the nature
> of epiphenomena.
> No, you don't know that.  If you have a conscious thought now that "has no
> behavioural manifestations whatsoever" you may remember it next year and
> change what you write on the every-thing list then.

By no behavioural manifestation, I am referring to the physical world being
causally closed. There is no physical event, including human actions, which
cannot be explained in terms of prior physical events. Mental events
supervene on physical events, but they have no separate causal efficacy of
their own. If they did, then we would see magical phenomena such as bones
moving without any applied force, breaching conservation laws, because that
would be the mind moving them. I can write about a mental state, but my
hand moving in order to write can be fully explained in terms of observable
physical processes in my brain, without needing to invoke any effects of
the mental state.


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