On 01/03/2013 10:36 AM, salyavin808 wrote: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Bhairitu wrote: >> On 01/03/2013 08:33 AM, salyavin808 wrote: >>> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "raunchydog" wrote: >>>> >>>> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Buck" wrote: >>>>> Trigunaji 1916- 1 Jan 2013 >>>>> >>>> In honor of Trigunaji's passing, >>> Interesting start to a story that seems to underline the whole >>> ayurveda story to me. It doesn't work. >>> >>> >>>> Triguna's herbs were bitter. I managed to get the herbs past my taste buds >>>> by mixing them with a small shot of tea, bolting it down and then chasing >>>> it with a big cup of tea. Never drink anything is India that isn't >>>> boiled. Anyway, the herbs didn't seem to work and I ended up taking >>>> Western medicine, which knocked out the bug in my "bad bowel." >>> Taking western medicine Raunchy, very shrewd. I've always thought that >>> experimenting with auyrveda (and all alternative health scams) was fine *as >>> long as there is nothing wrong with you* I know people that would still be >>> alive if they hadn't swallowed, hook line and stinker, the whole "perfect >>> science of health" bit that Marshy via Triguna was plugging. >>> >>> In fact I know someone who is very seriously ill because he eschewed >>> anti-biotics in favour of stone age hopefulness. Upon becoming ill he >>> took himself off to Marshy's favourite ayurveda clinic where, after a >>> predictably large fortune had been spent -and a cure not forthcoming- he >>> was told "there must be some doubt in you". Good medicine! >>> >>> Still, there's always the yagya programme to fall back on. Throwing >>> good money after bad IMO but when you truly believe this stuff what >>> else can you do? The TMO abandoned common sense a long time ago, leave >>> it in the hands of the gods! Might as well as spend any more money >>> on ayurveda . My friend will probably die a long slow miserable death and >>> everyone will rationalise it in the usual way and blame it on his "planets" >>> or rakshasas or something similarly untestable. >>> >>> Sometimes I think a crime is being committed but maybe it's just >>> the crime of stupidity. After all we are intelligent people who >>> are free to make choices based on evidence or beliefs. Seems a shame that >>> an org like the TMO with its proclaimed belief in science has such a shaky >>> superstitious core lying just beneath the surface, they >>> might be in a position to help people by recommending they go to >>> a proper doctor instead of clinging to the dream that they have all >>> the answers by taking your pulse and telling you to stare at the >>> moon. >>> >>> So why all the reverence? Would you really want to live in a world >>> where ayurveda was the only method of healthcare? Anyone? >>> >>> >>>> Jai Guru Dev, Trigunaji, rest in peace. >> Having studied ayurveda and even done an ayurvedic tour of India, I beg >> to differ. Maybe the difference is that I had an MD as an ayurvedic >> doctor. In fact I got his name from MAPI when I called to get a list of >> ayurvedic doctors in the SF Bay Area. However this MD had not only >> taken the MA doctor's course but Dr. Lad's as well. I also took some >> weekend workshops with a number of ayurvedic practitioners including Dr. >> Robert Svoboda. >> >> There are a lot of "cures" and "treatments" in allopathic disease >> maintenance that parallel ayurveda or probably even owe their roots to >> it and Chinese medicine. This time of year we would usually take some >> off the shelf cough and cold measures that have their roots in such >> medicine. The now defamed ephedrine is of course a synthetic derivation >> of the herb ephedra which is used in Chinese medicine and ayurveda was >> the principle decongestant in these. It's defamed only because meth >> cookers would buy it in bulk to make meth. Now, if you want it you have >> to register your purchase. Of course, ephedra grows all over the US as >> a weed. >> >> However due to ayurveda, unless I screw up somehow, I don't have to >> reach for such a concoction. If I start to experience even the >> slightest sing of cold, cough or flu and little homemade kapha tea ( 1 >> part ginger, 1 part cinnamon, dash clove) will make it do a quick exit. >> Adding a little black pepper will speed it up too. Recipe courtesy of >> Dr. Lad who has a lot of kitchen cures like that. >> >> Don't forget that "medicine for profit" Big Pharma patented the herb >> neem. Something outraged folks in India so they put together an >> organization to patent all their herbs to keep corporations from doing >> so. I suspect big pharma would disagree with you about whether ayurveda >> really works. >> >> Allopathic doctors are good for broken bones or other emergency >> measures. Most have little training in nutrition. Most are merely drug >> pushers for big pharma who isn't interested in curing a disease because >> there's too much money in just maintenancing it. I think of all the >> billions raised over the years for those "cure" telethons and none of >> those diseases are anywhere near cured. Big pharma thanks all the marks >> for that money. By all rights a lot of those diseases should be history >> by now. A lot of them are curable with alternative medicine. >> >> And ayurveda isn't the only alternative form of medicine I've studied >> but also Chinese in the form of macrobiotics (and not just the "eat >> brown rice thang") and also metabolic typing which continues to be an >> interest. BTW, I recently bought Dr. Harold Kristal's "The Nutrition >> Solution" which I think has the best explanation of metabolic typing. I >> found that book at Amazon and decided since I really didn't need a >> pristine copy of it to get it used for 42 cents (plus $3.99 shipping). >> The book arrived as if it had never even been thumbed through just as >> good as new. >> >> Capitalism has done a lot of damage and it has particularly ruined >> healthcare. > > Some good points Bhairitu, but none of them help my friend who is > ill and the ones who died all of whom were very into AV, and saw > all the Indian Dr's whenever they came over as they were close to the > heart of the TMO and had been for decades.
First off, Vasant Lad in his book "The Complete Book of Ayurvedic Home Remedies" includes "when to see a doctor" on ailments. Sounds like the people you mention were taking ayurveda a little too religiously. Like I said, my ayurvedic practitioner was an MD. He frequently commented on some of the practitioners in the Bay Area who were really not qualified to give advice on life and death situations. Dr. Robert Svoboda is known as one of the first American MDs to learn ayurvedic medicine. Dr. Dinesh Sharma, is a friend whose parents were MDs and his grandfather a vaidya. He learned ayurveda following his grandfather around. His parents insisted though on an allopathic career so he is an MD but not licensed to practice in the US because he has a family and couldn't afford the two year in-residence requirement to be licensed in the US. He is very good at simplifying the rules for ayurveda. > > I guess you are in the position of not having had anything go seriously wrong > yet. Treating colds and minor ailments with herbs will have benefits for some > but there is only so much you can do. As Raunchy says you've got to know when > to quit. You can treat a lot more than colds and ailments with ayurveda. Do you know that ayurveda even developed surgical techniques? There has always been a war between establishment medicine and alternative methods. It's always been about doctors protecting their money flow. Did you know that British MDs serving in India were banned from learning ayurveda because they were going back to Britain and using those techniques and upsetting the clique. This will probably come off about as well as the arguments I get around here from people who are against astrology whose clock I clean. Most have not ever learned astrology so they are talking out of their hat or as we sometimes like to say "reviewing a movie without having seen it." I don't know if you've taken any classes on ayurveda but it might be a little hard to judge it if you don't know what it is about. > > I know more people who have died young in the TMO than in my other life. > Can't draw anything from such a small sample and my TM friends > are generally older, but if you adjust the figures I'm sure it would come out > looking like longevity in the TMO isn't what you'd expect > from the wild claims they make. Several reasons. Inappropriate vegetarianism which can make the blood too alkaline and give rise to diseases like leukemia and melanoma. I have also suspected in some cases people actually overdoing vata imbalance pharmacology which can make the blood too acid giving rise to other diseases. And some people just had congenital diseases which in some case were predicted to take them out by the thirties but made it into their fifties. You're lucky you live in a country with single payer healthcare. The US is a circus when it comes to healthcare and the profiteering very obvious. The best thing people can do is learn as much as they can about alternative methods and use them to keep an eye on their body as if it were a sports car they need to tune daily to run properly.
