--- authfriend <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Peter > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > > MMY's personality is very much a product of his > time > > and culture. It has nothing to do with anything > > "cosmic". Blazing Brahman expresses itself through > an > > aging, slightly senile, lower-caste, 89 year old > Hindu > > man who has run a spiritual movement with an iron > fist > > for the past 50 years. > > Boy, I think this is an important point. > > Peter, would it also be correct to phrase it > slightly differently and say, This is *how* > Blazing Brahman is expressing itself through > this particular aging, slightly senile, > lower-caste, 89-year-old Hindu man who has > run a spiritual movement with an iron fist > for the past 50 years? Yes, better stated your way. > > I mean, obviously one has to think MMY has > *realized* Blazing Brahman in order to make > either of these two statements. > > But people tend to look at the *expression*, > find it to be much less than what they think > of as "perfection" in a relative sense, and > on that basis assume MMY has *not* realized > Brahman. Agreed. If you're looking for relative perfection in a realized master, good luck! For example in a residential Art of Living course I took about a year ago with SSRS in residence, I was bothered by his casual manner in talking about funny stories from his ashram and people throwing themselves at his feet. He wasn't making fun of them or anything but was talking about the difficulty in walking around and how much time it took to go from one end of his ashram to another. Very funny, very cute story. But I was amazed at part of my own reaction. I wanted him to be more serious and aloof and not have the reaction he did. Just some silly relative ideal of what a guru should be. My attachment, my problem, not his. > > Of course whether he has or hasn't is still > one's individual take; it's just that the take > shouldn't be based, it seems to me, on the > perceived distance of the expression from what > they would consider relative perfection. The first time I saw MMY in 1972 my mind blew wide open and left absolutely no doubts about his Realized status. And in every ensuing contact with him over the years this has happened over and over again with the experience getting deeper and deeper everytime. > > So what should it be based on?? I assume > realized people and nonrealized people have > different ways of evaluating MMY's state of > consciousness. Your own direct experience...only! > > From my unrealized perspective, it's a > combination of a gut hunch, and my awe at the > depth, comprehensiveness, and internal > consistency of his teaching on the nature and > mechanics of consciousness (including its > implementation in the TM technique), as well > as the teaching'sextraordinary explanatory value. Right, you find great value in his teachings. > > It just doesn't seem possible to me that a person, > no matter how brilliant their mind, could come up > with such a teaching purely on an intellectual > basis. It has to be coming from some basis in > higher intuitive knowledge (or Knowledge, to > distinguish it from intellectual knowledge). Ageed! > > Of course, that's still based on a sense of how > close MMY's expression comes to my idea of > relative perfection, which is what I just said > you shouldn't do. I don't think we can ever, to a complete degree, get away from this. In fact, it perhaps is a foolish "spiritual "ideal. > > Now I'm trying to figure out on what basis I think > evaluating his teaching on the nature and mechanics > of consciousness is a more appropriate criterion on > which to have an opinion of his realization, versus > evaluating the sensibleness of his political and > social pronouncements and what he's been doing with > the TMO. > > Help me out here. They're both measuring what MMY > expresses against a personal idea of relative > perfection. Why should choosing one *type* of > expression over another make a difference? Or > are both approaches essentially absurd? > > Obviously I've gone off on something of a tangent > here... Yeah, but a good tangent.... I think, ultimately, the value of a guru/master is in him/her functioning as a catalyst for one's own realization. This is appreciated by people as their experiences with the body of techniques offered, the intellectual knowledge, and the transcendent darshan experiences with the master. > > > > > > > The value of our interaction > > with him has nothing to do with the "surface" of > this > > relationship. This "surface" always varies from > guru > > to guru and is quite irrelevent to the > transcendent > > value of the relationship. MMY doesn't give a damn > > about your personality. It is utterly irrelevent > to > > your Realization. > > > > --- Premanand Paul Mason <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > wrote: > > > > > I have received an email relating to a press > > > conference in which MMY > > > allegedly "made himself look and sound like an > Ill > > > tempered raving > > > lunatic." > <snip> > > > > > > > ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor > --------------------~--> > Ever feel sad or cry for no reason at all? > Depression. 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