--- In [email protected], anonymousff <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In [email protected], "jim_flanegin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > > --- In [email protected], anonymousff <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > enlightenment does not adhere > > > > > > to ANY tradition. It is what it is. Period. > > > > > > > > > > I've been given to understand that enlightenment > > > > > changes quite a bit from one spiritual tradition to > > > > > another. I'm told, for instance, that Buddhists > > > > > disagree with Hindus on key points, and when > > > > > their adherents attain end states they call awakening > > > > > or enlightenment, the attainees describe their > > > > > experiences differently from one another but > > > > > consistent with their traditions. > > > > > > > > > > Native Americans have no such states in their > > > > > traditions, suggesting enlightenment is not > > > > > something that all traditions recognize. > > > > > > > > > > View determines fruit, as Vaj quoted a master > > > > > as saying. Or as Dana Sawyer says, precept > > > > > determines percept. > > > > > > > > > > I'm not sure if I'm disagreeeing with you here, Jim. > > > > > I don't know enough about either side of the discussion. > > > > > I'm simply expressing some cognitive dissonance with > > > > > the statement that enlightenment does not adhere to > > > > > any tradition. > > > > > > > > > Uh-oh, I see another Paradox! Just ample warning for those that > > wish > > > > to read no further... > > > > > > > > Spiritual traditions are all useful, and thank God there are a > > lot > > > > of them, to serve us all in such diversity. > > > > > > > > What I meant by my remark was that once enlightenment is > > reached, > > > > the spiritual tradition we have followed loses its uniqueness, > > and > > > > in some ways much of its value; an enlightened Buddhist shares > > the > > > > same view as an enlightened Hindu or Sufi or whatever. > > > > > > Says who? Your intuition? Precisely which enlightened Buddhists, > > > Hindus and Sufis did you talk to regarding this. Or are you just > > > spouting off platitudes that sound good. > > > > > I looked up platitude: > > sorry you had to look it up. A comment on American education. > > > > a banal, trite, or stale remark. Anyone that > > knows me personally knows that I am just about anti-platitude. > > I only know you from your writing and the above is surely not clear > from that vantage. > > > What > > is the value of spouting off platitudes? as they are from memory, > > exactly as you describe; to make one feel good. > > > > But the difference is they are mood-making. I already expressed > > myself regarding mood-making. > > Again, not reflected in the logic and content of your actual writing. > > > You also asked, 'says who'? Good > > question. Do you have an answer? > > Well you said it "an enlightened Buddhist shares the same view as an > enlightened Hindu or Sufi or whatever." Apparrently with no > substantiation. Which is my point. You are spouting dogma you heard. > Wake up and do some research and process your own thoughts. > > > > > > Oddly enough, once enlightenment blossoms, all of the ways of > > all of > > > > the spiritual traditions become accessible, > > > > > > And you are quite familiar with all the ways of all the spiritual > > > traditions? Again, it sounds like feel-good platitudes, nothing > > > actually based on studying such traditions and talking to their > > > proponents. Tell us about the aghori and nath practices you have > > > accessed since becoming self-proclaimed enlightened? > > > > > > > so that we gain a much > > > > stronger intuitive appreciation of all of the traditions, and > > can enjoy them as we wish. > > > > > > Sounds like a MUM first year student doing sing-song. > > > > > Oh well. Perhaps you can say it better? I try mightily to write > > well, and sometimes I fail. > > First, I would, and have, reounced dogma echoing in my mind. That is a > vow you appear to not have yet taken. And when it appears in my mind I > ask "do I really know if this is true". Usually, I can't say that I > do. So I do some research. On the matter of equal views of > enlightenment by Hindus, Christians, Moslems, Sufis, Buddhists, > Shaman, first I have come to recognize a huge diversity of opinion and > experience even within each of these traditions. And greater diversity > among these grand traditions. > > To sing-song that all religious and spiritual traditions essentially > have a shankarian non-dualistic advaitist view is silly and shallow. > But...you keep reading into my words. I never said that. I said that the end result of all of these religious and spiritual traditions is the same. Else they are not worth the paper their scriptures are written on.
They come from the same source. They return us to the same source. That is what I said. And I wouldn't know a 'shankarian non-dualistic advaitist view' if it walked up and bit me. ------------------------ Yahoo! Groups Sponsor --------------------~--> Dying to be thin? Anorexia. Narrated by Julianne Moore. http://us.click.yahoo.com/abEMxA/sbOLAA/d1hLAA/0NYolB/TM --------------------------------------------------------------------~-> To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
