--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "authfriend" <jstein@> wrote: > > > > Was in a rush before; want to add a couple things: > > > > --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB <no_reply@> wrote: > > <snip> > > > *Without a doubt*, these people's enlightenment was > > > self-evident to them. There was no question in their > > > minds that it existed. But did it? > > > > I have no idea. Do you? > > Not a clue. > > > > I'm just sayin' that there is a big "red flag" > > > raised for me when someone believes one of their > > > "stories" so completely > > > > And Jim was just sayin' that the nature of > > enlightenment is such that it falls outside the > > category of "stories," something of which you're > > apparently not aware. > > And I *understand* that some people believe this. > I do not. Neither do spiritual traditions such > as the Tibetan one Vaj mentioned. > > I am a strong believer in enlightenment, and I > believe that the experience of it should be under > exactly the same scrutiny and subject to the same > analysis as any other experience, if not more. It > isn't "exempt." > What basis do you have for believing that Rory and I see it any other way? Is it because of what Vaj said? And why do you believe Vaj more than you believe either of us?
Ask yourself this please and let the rest of FFL know the answer if you would: Why is it you are inclined to only believe in enlightenment from a distance, either psychologically (paraphrase of Barry: "we are always enlightened, we just need to realize it..."- yes, and that means it can be escaped from at any time too), physically (paraphrase of Barry: "those that say they are enlightened here, are not"- yes, because if they were, they could be talking to you right now), or mentally (paraphrase of Barry: "those who say they are enlightened need to be able to doubt their experiences"- yes, because it again makes the immediate experience of enlightenment doubtful, and distant). I think you are afraid of enlightenment Barry. Very, very afraid of it. Prove me otherwise.:-)
