Exactly, I think it is a useless and void concept if one defines it in
this way. It makes sense the other way round: the stronger the
emergence, the weaker the causal dependence.
Yet although we agree there is no mysterious downward causation,
we can without doubt consciously influence the activities and movements
of our body. If there is no downward causation, who is causing these
activities? What do you think?
* Wrong question, the actor is not a single entity ?
* Self-consciousness does not trigger actions, it impedes actions
(Hamlet's to be or not to be comes to mind) ?
* We are not the actor of our own story, just the witness of it?
-J.
----- Original Message -----
From: "russell standish" <[email protected]>
To: <[email protected]>; "The Friday Morning Applied Complexity
Coffee Group" <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, June 12, 2009 3:17 AM
Subject: Re: [FRIAM] quick question
On Thu, Jun 11, 2009 at 07:01:38PM -0600, Nicholas Thompson wrote:
Steve,
My understanding of the meaning of "strong" emergence is "inexplicable
emergence".
Is there another meaning?
N
Bedau defines it as emergence with downward causation. For example, we
would say
that consciousness is strongly emergent if we felt that we could
consciously influence the activities of our neurons, rather than
simply our consciousness simply being the result of neuronal activity.
I'm not sure this notion has any use in discussions other than
consciousness, and even there the notion of epiphenomenalism would say
that it is void concept.
Cheers
--
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Prof Russell Standish Phone 0425 253119 (mobile)
Mathematics
UNSW SYDNEY 2052 [email protected]
Australia http://www.hpcoders.com.au
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Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College
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