Hi there,
I agree that books, tutorials, etc. are very much needed.
At Zend we are currently looking into leading a Zend Framework book (already
talking to publishers). However, I would like to encourage others who have
interest to also start such efforts. There are many publishers out there, Zend
Framework is an easy sell (I can help you if needed), and the more books are on
the shelves the better. Books very much differ in their approaches so I don't
think there'll be a one-size-fits-all book. I agree that in most cases books
don't make you loads of cash but they definitely help build your image as an
expert and therefore long-term can be a significant part of building a
successful career.
We are also working on a small sample application (a lightweight blog) to show
people how to use Zend Framework to build a real app. The focus here will be on
showcasing framework and not writing an application that can compete with other
full-featured blogging applications. I don't have timing at this point and I
believe we also need more than one sample app, so again, the more the community
can contribute and help with educational materials the better.
Re: API stability, our goal is to keep the API as stable as possible. Of course
I can't make promises but we will try our best. I also think that in the coming
months we will be focusing more on 1.1, 1.2, etc.. than on a major version.
There are still many things we want to work on which are of high value but will
fit into the 1.x product line.
Andi
________________________________
From: Pádraic Brady [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2007 2:05 PM
To: Kevin McArthur
Cc: Zend Framework General
Subject: Re: [fw-general] ZF Book
Hi Shekar,
Likely echoing a lot of people - books take time, and they are highly
unreliable for at least the first few iterations of any software. Given the
rate of development in the Zend Framework, a version late 1.x/2.0 would have to
be seriously considered as a possible publication target (otherwise the risk of
outdated texts is likely quite high - at least if one makes a few assumptions
about publication dates, likely demand, and time-to-write). 2.0 is probably out
on the horizon - depends.
That said, now would be a good time to get started on the bulk of the
standard unchanging elements (actually the release of 0.9 would have been ;)).
We have a stable API, and ongoing changes are unlikely to prove rapid (or
blatantly off the map). Also, one would lack a sponsoring publisher at this
time which will only get worse over the next few months as publication houses
grab up experienced writers and ZF users (or at least writers who can gain
familiarity in time) - something I gather is happening already from comments
elsewhere, in a few places, given the publicity of the ZF and its growing
mindshare.
It probably wouldn't be all that hard to round up a few interested
persons however, if there was a little more certainty about the future of such
a proposed book, what one would seek in an author, and how the
copyright/licensed distribution would play out (assuming the immediate lack of
an interested publisher). I'm sure Cristain has more ideas here - he's at least
penetrated the Irish market judging from my bookshelf where he's noted at least
twice ;).
Not to be a discouraging note - a book definitely would have an
audience. It would be interesting to hear more obviously.
Regards,
Pádraic
Pádraic Brady
http://blog.astrumfutura.com
http://www.patternsforphp.com
----- Original Message ----
From: Kevin McArthur <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Richard D Shank <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Shekar C Reddy <[EMAIL
PROTECTED]>
Cc: Zend Framework General <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2007 8:40:21 PM
Subject: Re: [fw-general] ZF Book
FYI There are actually several Zend Framework books in production.
I will be featuring some framework (but by no means the focus) in my
upcoming book and I am aware of other ZFW feature books in development.
Remember it takes a LONG time to publish a book, and the reason there
is nothing on the market right now is the framework's extremely high rate of
change. No one wants to write a book that is dated by the time it hits shelves.
Kevin
----- Original Message -----
From: Richard D Shank <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Shekar C Reddy <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: Zend Framework General <mailto:[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, July 31, 2007 1:35 PM
Subject: Re: [fw-general] ZF Book
The biggest problem with writing a book is the time it takes
verses the payoff. Its a great way to get recognition (and credibility) but
not a great way to make money. That being said, I have toyed with the idea of
doing that. I have done a little writing in the past and I have been playing
with ZF. My plans are to write a CMS with ZF and I thought I might write a
book about the process. Thats the extent of what I have played with in my head.
It would be nice to know what the community felt would be
needed to make a great book. If there were enough interest, I would consider
pursuing the idea further. I definitely don't want to get into a situation
like is going on right now with jQuery community, with several people writing
books at once.
Richard
Shekar C Reddy wrote:
Hi All,
This has reference to:
http://devzone.zend.com/article/1795-The-Definitive-Guide-to-symfony
<http://devzone.zend.com/article/1795-The-Definitive-Guide-to-symfony>
http://devzone.zend.com/article/1795-The-Definitive-Guide-to-symfony---Sample-Chapter#comments-1820
<http://devzone.zend.com/article/1795-The-Definitive-Guide-to-symfony---Sample-Chapter#comments-1820>
ZF has matured into 1.0 but no books or discussions
about bringing one out yet other than some tidbits found on the internet (no
offense intended; most of those tidbits are indeed great pieces of code!) and
the alphabetical API reference guide. Joining pieces together and
cross-referring to the reference guide is no easy task - most times it results
in half-baked knowledge, not to mention - code with bottle-necks! What we need
is a complete tutorial book that does a project and utilizes all the components
in concert and shows how they integrate with each other. I interacted with Cal
earlier on this matter (email chain pasted below) about collaborating with an
experienced author - Cristain Darie.
I understand writing books takes a considerable amount
of time. Any takers with some time to spare on producing a book on ZF? Cristain
would be glad to help/guide you with getting started...
Here is another to consider:
http://devzone.zend.com/article/1118-Symfony-used-in-Yahoo-Bookmarks-Beta
<http://devzone.zend.com/article/1118-Symfony-used-in-Yahoo-Bookmarks-Beta>
(QUOTE: The documentation was the first reason for
Yahoo to choose Symfony. It reaches a unique quality and coverage in the
open-source world)
Regards,
On 4/26/07, Shekar C Reddy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Hi Cal,
Would you like me to post this idea to the
gw-general list to see if there are any folks with writing skills that would
collaborate with another author?
On 4/6/07, Cal Evans <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Hi Shekar,
I'll have to check my notes as I don't
recall Christian contacting me. I know rumors of a couple of projects in the
works right now but I'm not currently involved with any of them.
=C=
Cal Evans
Editor-in-Chief,
http://devzone.zend.com <http://devzone.zend.com/>
AIM:CalZend Skype: CalAtZend
From: Shekar C Reddy [mailto:[EMAIL
PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, April 06, 2007 3:11 PM
To: Cal Evans
Subject: Re: ZF Book?
Cal,
Well! I was wondering about the current
fate of the ZF book as the framework is reaching 1.0 soon. I introduced you
Cristian Darie who would help you with anything you folks might need from
project planning, writing, editing, publishing.... Was Cristian able to answer
your questions and guide you in any way?
Regards,
On 3/16/07, Shekar C Reddy <[EMAIL
PROTECTED]> wrote:
Cal,
Here is the response from Cristian (my
Yahoo ID is PowerObject):
QUOTE
Cristian Darie (3/16/2007 11:44:57 AM):
Hey, thanks for this! Please put them in touch with me -- I'm not sure if I'll
have the time to start writing a new book, but at least I can give them some
advice. The idea of a book on the Zend Framework sounds very exciting though!
PowerObject: I sent your email IDs to
Cal Evans ( [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ) and he might contact
you. If this idea jells, there may be a couple of writers/developers who might
collaborate with you.
PowerObject: Hi, Would you be willing
to collaborate with another writer at Zend.com <http://zend.com/> on producing
a book on Zend Framework that is reaching v1.0 ? Do let me know so I can inform
them and introduce you to each other so you can take it from there...
UNQUOTE
Its your call now... ? :)
On 3/16/07, Shekar C Reddy <[EMAIL
PROTECTED]> wrote:
Cal,
No, not postulating :) I know you are a
great writer with excellent authoring skills! And I guess you (as an active
user of ZF) are a good fit to come up with a book on ZF around the release of
1.0 (or even later). If you think it is too huge a task to handle, you (along
with some developers of ZF) could colloborate with other authors. I know
Cristian Darie ( www.cristiandarie.ro <http://www.cristiandarie.ro/> ) - an
author who collaborates with other authors and has dished out some great books
successfully. Here are his email IDs: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL
PROTECTED]> / [EMAIL PROTECTED] <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]> and you could
contact him directly (I just sent him an IM, too). I'm sure he should be
willing to work on this book. We tried to produce a book on PowerBuilder
earlier when I used to have some spare time but as the language was dying,
there were no other takers from the community other than Cristian so the idea
did not take off.
As a user, I wish ZF evolves into a
very mature framework. The framework already has some good strengths to itself
- compared to Symfony - such as:
*** Light weight !!
Component-based (use just what you need)
Non-monolithic
Search-engine friendly URLs
Placement of source outside the doc-root
Based on PHP 5.2
OOP
MVC
DRY
KISS
RAD
PDO
TDD
Design patterns
Quality code
Enterprise-ready
Some great components: Acl, Auth,
Cache, Config, Db, Json, Locale, Lucene, Mail, Pdf, Rest, Service, Translate...
Community (users/contributors)
and comparing to other frameworks out
there, what we need to come up with for its wider adaptation are: elaborate
documentation, tutorials, wiki, books, audios, videos and what not...? A
beginner should be thrilled to watch a video and see how easy it is to build a
blogging service in 20 mins and be able to send an email in 10 mins using ZF!!
Hope that helps...
PS: I had a great difficulty with
posting the comment as it bombed several times accusing me that my HTML
formatting was invalid for no apparent reason :(
On 3/16/07, Cal Evans <[EMAIL
PROTECTED]> wrote:
Shekar,
Something you want to announce? :) Or
were you just postulating?
=C=
________________________________
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