"Kevin A. Burton" wrote:
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> Jon Stevens <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> > <http://news.cnet.com/news/0-1003-200-6839693.html?tag=mn_hd>
> <snip>
>
> I hate this!
>
> "Sun called on consumers "to demand that Microsoft include the Java platform in
> their XP operating system." Sun also said consumers should demand "PC vendors
> like Dell, Compaq, Gateway, IBM and HP (Hewlett-Packard) include the Java
> platform in their applications."
I don't have a problem with this at all. It means that I can have clients install
my software without having to download anything first. Sure it helps SUN, but it
also helps me. Kind of a win/win situation if you will.
Another benefit will be a larger number of people complaining to SUN about certain
defects or performance drops with every new release of the Java language (1.3 is
slower than 1.2 which is slower than 1.1.x on several IO routines). I realize that
JDK 1.4 is supposed to seriously address these issues, but there are other issues
with JDK 1.4.
> Why would we want yet ANOTHER proprietary application shipped as a standard on
> an OS? It would be a different story if the JVM were OSS but guess what? It
> isn't. Why would I want to help SUN increase their stranglehold over the
> computer industry?
It truly is a convenience. If a user is buying a PC with JRE preinstalled, they
will use it--or explore using programs that use it. It opens up a
lot of potential clients for our OSS projects. Let's face it, we chose to build
a lot of projects on a proprietary "standard".
> It seems to me that as soon as they OSS Java, all their problems will go away:
I disagree, see below.
> - - No more competition from .NET/C#. (why would anyone want to support an MS
> proprietary language?)
You might think that, but there are a number of MS shops out there who implement
things on MS technology because it was MS. Case and point, I worked on a project
for a couple state law enforcement agencies, and my employer insisted on an all
MS technology. When we tried to drum up more business, the remaining states were
clamoring for Oracle and Unix--so the division folded up with two successful
projects under it's belt. The example shows both the danger of dependency on
MS technology, and the cycle of dependancy it forces you in.
> - - If it were GPL/LGPL MS couldn't embrace and extend?
They would find a way--or they would step up the FUD campaign. With SUN controlling
Java, there is little that MS can do to belittle it. SUN has proven itself in
the marketplace, and serves as that single point to blame if something goes wrong.
That accountability keeps SUN honest in regards to Java.
> - - All the bugs that have been sitting in the JVM for *years* will finally get
> fixed.
I would have to agree to this point. SUN does need to explore methods of accepting
patches from the general community--but they still need to be in control. The
truth is some of those patches will inevitably break something else in another system
altogether. Java is HUGE, and no one user will be able to test *every* use of a
core object. Of course, they could test to spec--in which case all other areas that
break have to be fixed.
Allowing just anyone to commit a patch without full testing could cause some high
paying customers alot of headache.
> - - They don't have to spend the millions of dollars they spend on maintaining the
> JVM.
They can explore a number of options with maintaining the JVM that could potentially
lower the amount that they spend. Basically the cost of maintaining the JVM won't
change (it might even increase), but it will be spread accross many companies that
maintain it.
> - - Universal industry acceptance of Java.
Ok, you now have bitten the "OSS is the god of the software world" bug. OSSing Java
would actually alienate a number of large IT firms. I know personally a couple
customers of my company that would not allow it on their servers simply because it
is open source. (They don't allow Apache HTTPD on their servers for that reason,
even if it has been proven time and again).
> - - Tons of cool stuff! :)
That's pretty specific. ;P
-- Loss of millions of marketing dollars and industry buzz
Let's face it, SUN promotes Java well. By making them lose control of the platform,
what incentive will they have? SUN will pull a MS and put together another competing
standard.
What I would like to see is something *better* than the JCP. I believe in open
research.
OSS fits a great many needs, but there are some key points in Free Software (GPL/LGPL)
that
I don't necessarily agree with.
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