Greg, I think you bring up a good point about a re-write, and there's no question many packages and parts of Vista are way overdue, because they were neglected for so long.
Re-casting them in another language, adds another level of complexity to the project, IMO. It doesn't mean it will fail, it just adds complexity. -----Original Message----- From: Greg Woodhouse [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 10:53 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [Hardhats-members] Re: MDC/MUG Revival - Just do it My take is that the basic assumption is that code has limited "shelf life"; i.e., that there is a point beyond ewhich continuing to patch the same code without reriting it is counterproductive. If you grant this assumption, then the next question becomes: What technolog(ies) should we use in our next rewrite? That leads logically to another question, which is: What are the advantages and disadvantages of using a given technology? This is where I think we have failed to make the case, because so often the issue is framed not in terms of what advantages there are in using M(UMPS), but whether a significant rewrite is needed at all. --- "Sowinski, Richard J." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I think what has been glazed over so far in regard to VA leadership's > > arguments on the death of M are the following. > > 1. Leadership's position: No M programmers. > > The truth is, the VA always grew their own via in-house training. > It was > very easy to > grow their own, because people with any background in computer > science or > engineering > can become production-level competent in a matter of weeks. Folks > without > a strong > theoretical background may take a bit longer, but M is still > easier to > learn than just > about any other computer language. > > 2. Leadership's position: No MUG. > > How have they supported MUG ? At the last MUG meeting I went to in > San > Diego, most of > the VA people self-funded their trip there. There were no speakers > or > breakout session > leaders from the the National VA development organization. > > 3. Leadership's position: M is old technology. > > Yes, old but good, hardware independent, and evolving. > > 4. Leadership's position: Go to Oracle. > > How does this promote vendor independence ? > > Finally, none of this new "rehosted" stuff has hit the streets yet. > It > remains to be seen > if any of it works, and how well it can be supported in the field. > > There have been no cost comparisons or justifications, so that side > of the > equation seems to be completely > disregarded. > > Another CoreFLs scale disaster would certainly set back the > "rehosting" > efforts, and would > (hopefully) cause some leaders to rethink their positions. > > I am not a prophet either, but I am a computer scientist, and I think > I can > see that things > are rather chaotic now, and there is not alot of clarity in "the > vision". > Or, if there is, > it hasn't been articulated very well. > > But, as Rick says "we'll see". > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Richard G. DAVIS [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2004 11:33 AM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: MDC/MUG Revival - Just do it > > > Rick's "letter" to Kevin fails on only one small point... ...it is > not > presented in a forum that accords it the distinctive position it > deserves. > > So, I urge you all to set aside a day in your week, any day will do, > and > read only this letter. Struggle with it, wrestle with it, meditate > and put > it aside for another week. Continue that devotion far into the > future and > be ever mindful of the gathering illumination that you will enjoy. > > Regards, > > Richard. > -- > > > > > From: "Frederick D. S. Marshall" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Organization: WorldVistA > > Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Date: Fri, 26 Nov 2004 16:29:04 -0800 > > To: Hardhats <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Subject: [Hardhats-members] Re: MDC/MUG Revival - Just do it > > > > Dear Kevin, > > > > We are not in a catch-22. > > > > The Object-Oriented Language subcommittee (SC16) of the MDC spent > many > > years examining the state of the art in OO languages and databases > to > > determine how MUMPS should be upgraded with OO features. We know > how to > >... > >.... > >..... > >...... > > > > I do not know who will pay for MUMPS's development, but I do not > need to > > know. I suspect someone will, sooner or later. We will pursue our > > work, time will pass, and then we will learn the answer to your > > question. I am no prophet, merely a philosopher. > > > > > > On Fri, 2004-11-26 at 06:54, Kevin Toppenberg wrote: > >> My thoughts are, who is going to pluck the cash down > >> on the table to actually write the code the > >> new-and-improved M? > >>... > >>.... > >>..... > >> > >> I think we are in a catch-22 > >> > >> Kevin > > > > > .. > ... > .... > > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > SF email is sponsored by - The IT Product Guide > Read honest & candid reviews on hundreds of IT Products from real > users. > Discover which products truly live up to the hype. Start reading now. > > http://productguide.itmanagersjournal.com/ > _______________________________________________ > Hardhats-members mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/hardhats-members > > > ------------------------------------------------------- > SF email is sponsored by - The IT Product Guide > Read honest & candid reviews on hundreds of IT Products from real > users. > Discover which products truly live up to the hype. Start reading now. > > http://productguide.itmanagersjournal.com/ > _______________________________________________ > Hardhats-members mailing list > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/hardhats-members > ===== A practical man is a man who practices the errors of his forefathers. --Benjamin Disraeli ==== Greg Woodhouse [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] ------------------------------------------------------- SF email is sponsored by - The IT Product Guide Read honest & candid reviews on hundreds of IT Products from real users. Discover which products truly live up to the hype. Start reading now. http://productguide.itmanagersjournal.com/ _______________________________________________ Hardhats-members mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/hardhats-members ------------------------------------------------------- SF email is sponsored by - The IT Product Guide Read honest & candid reviews on hundreds of IT Products from real users. Discover which products truly live up to the hype. Start reading now. http://productguide.itmanagersjournal.com/ _______________________________________________ Hardhats-members mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/hardhats-members
