Was that a total year outdoors or just 10 days?
On Wed, Jul 23, 2014 at 12:18 PM, Dan March <[email protected]> wrote: > Watch out for contact cement losing it in high heat! I used it (the > original non-water-based - because DAP recommended it over the water > version) to attach vinyl fabric in my interior build-out of my Sprinter > here in LA (where we see Burning Man temps). It started off looking great, > seemed to have an excellent bond to metal, wood, etc. When it started > letting go a year or so later, I asked around and sure enough, it's not > that uncommon. > > > On Wed, Jul 23, 2014 at 11:29 AM, Bruiser Smith <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> Hi Jacob - >> >> I've read your posts on here, the guide and videos on your Google Drive, >> as well as your posts on Eplaya. First off - thank you for putting together >> such a comprehensive guide! I am looking to apply this to my pentayurt >> (H10) this year, and have a couple questions which would greatly help me >> out: >> >> >> 1. What are your thoughts following the method of foil taping the >> edges rather than using masking tape or contact cement? I already have a >> large roll of 3" foil. >> 2. For the 'loose' hinges, did you use both 7 inch on the inside as >> well as the outside? >> 3. Thoughts on using vinyl/cc hinges for doors & windows? >> 4. For my structure, which needs longer lengths of vinyl, can't I >> just buy a few yards of vinyl and cut them length-wise? >> 5. Thoughts on using a hand roller to minimize bubbles? >> http://www.istscientific.com/user/products/large/quickseal-hand-roller.jpg >> >> >> Again I can't thank you enough for putting together all of the resources >> that you have!!!! >> >> On Sunday, July 7, 2013 11:45:17 PM UTC-6, Jacob Rodriguez wrote: >>> >>> Sorry, not sure about "tap plastics". The stuff I'm buying is used for >>> covering furniture, or used as storm windows or whatever. Marine vinyl is >>> really good. I used to think it was 4 gauge vinyl, but it's actually 12 >>> gauge. Probably best to make sure it's UV treated, but mine doesn't say >>> specifically and is proving itself quite well outside for the past month or >>> so. No cracking or getting hard or anything. Anything that is sold to be >>> used outdoors is what you're looking for. >>> >>> Here's a link to Amazon to give you an idea of what you want: >>> http://www.amazon.com/No-Manufacturer-Gauge-Clear- >>> Vinyl/dp/B003ZFA4LM/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1373261515&sr=8- >>> 1&keywords=12+gauge+vinyl >>> >>> I've also just updated a document that explains a lot of stuff here >>> <https://docs.google.com/document/d/1x-PUR8OMG-4_uxGuXYmoctYTdwBAl8R0mYkJc0gnCYY/edit?usp=sharing>. >>> One thing I just learned is not to use the "eco friendly" contact cement >>> that cleans up with water. Use the hardcore stuff. I'm all for saving the >>> environment, but the 'Woodweld' in a green can is not what you want (takes >>> too long to get tacky and dry). Find the "original" stuff in the red can if >>> you can. >>> >>> Using 4 vs 6 inches is up to you. I'm personally going with 4 inches for >>> my tight hinges (giving me 2 inches of contact on either board) and then 7 >>> inch strips on my loose hinges (3 inches will be taken up by my board >>> thickness (1.5"), and then 2" on each surface). In my experience, that >>> seems to be plenty strong. See my tests >>> <https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=0B9akv0Z5bU-IazJmZ2NHa2l3dVU&usp=sharing> >>> (labeled >>> "Test") on various things. Those prototypes only have 1.5 inches on each >>> board, and some of that is over masking tape, reducing their adhesion; they >>> hold up pretty well. Though it never hurts to overbuild, and if you're >>> doing a regular hexayurt, you won't use too much, so why not? On my quad >>> dome, I have something like 136 joins/edges that need to be done, so I will >>> require about 31 yds of the stuff. Something like that anyway. >>> >>> Have fun! >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Friday, July 5, 2013 10:00:32 PM UTC-7, Steve Upstill (Swifty) wrote: >>>> >>>> I LOVE this discussion of hinging technology and I'm sold on replacing >>>> my "permanent" tape hinges with the vinyl/contact cement combo--at least >>>> for purposes of experimentation. Could someone with experience provide a >>>> quick buying guide for the stuff? Vinyl is a many-varied beast and it would >>>> be nice to know exactly what to head for. Is Tap Plastics my friend in this >>>> department? Anybody have any data about 4" vs. 6" strips? ...and so >>>> forth... >>>> >>>> Many Thanks, >>>> Steve Upstill >>>> >>>> On Thursday, March 28, 2013 1:17:41 PM UTC-7, Jacob Rodriguez wrote: >>>>> >>>>> So, I'm going to be building a quarter sized nearodesic polyhedron >>>>> ("quad") dome (1 rmax sheet = 8 triangles) for BRC this year. >>>>> >>>>> My foamcore and masking tape prototypes (1:12 and 1:5 scale) have been >>>>> going well. I'm learning how to do the tape hinges, and how to miter the >>>>> edges with a razor and angled metal guide. I'm thinking that the full size >>>>> version will be relatively easy to prepare and construct. My end result is >>>>> a 6' high, 12' diameter dome that folds down into a 4' x 4' x 15" high >>>>> box. >>>>> Minimal tape is required as all but one edge of each quad is hinged with >>>>> fabric and adhesive. Only the top square, and 4 "corners" need to be fully >>>>> taped together. >>>>> >>>>> I'm seeing lots of people commenting on how the BFT (bi-filament tape) >>>>> is not really UV resistant, so it flakes off eventually. Also, that it's >>>>> barely a semi-permanent solution, even if you do tape hinges instead of >>>>> one-time assembly. I've considered many different types of ways to join >>>>> the >>>>> triangles that would last more than one or two times: >>>>> >>>>> - zippers (needed like 400 of them, really really expensive) >>>>> - button snaps and straps (would glue on the snaps to the boards, then >>>>> use a strap to snap them together; this is not weather proof at all) >>>>> - velcro (again, pretty expensive if you use the really good velcro, >>>>> which is likely the only way to guarantee structural integrity and >>>>> 'weatherproof-ness') >>>>> - magnets (even using strong ones (N45), embedding them in the edges >>>>> of the triangles, they could jsut fall out, and still not weather proof. >>>>> also $$$) >>>>> >>>>> ..and a couple of other ideas. I've learned that putting metal >>>>> hooks/rods/bolts (binder clips) through the boards will just rip through >>>>> it >>>>> with a strong enough tug. They could end up just getting loose and boring >>>>> out big holes. Using plus-shaped ("+") hooks/rods to fasten some sort of >>>>> fabric over the joints are slightly better because they resist being >>>>> pulled >>>>> like a wire cutter through the board, but you would have holes in the >>>>> board >>>>> and water could get in. Also, excessive force would also just make the >>>>> holes looser and ruin the boards eventually. But the idea of using some >>>>> sort of fabric seems to hold merit. >>>>> >>>>> My main goal is to build something that can easily be packed away, and >>>>> assembled multiple time. Realizing that the main principles of a good BM >>>>> structure are to seal out rain, dust and light, I think I've come up with >>>>> a >>>>> possible solution, but I'm curious why I can't find anyone who has tried >>>>> it.* >>>>> I'm hoping to get some cautionary tales or some encouragement on using >>>>> sport nylon (as opposed to ripstop), and some Super 77 or 80 or 90 spray >>>>> adhesive, instead of the traditional tape.* >>>>> >>>>> The cost might be a little more expensive up front (depending on some >>>>> factors), but I'm thinking that the nylon will last much longer than just >>>>> about any tape and is probably just as strong (if not stronger) than BFT. >>>>> From what I've read, a lot of people end up using some 77 spray anyway >>>>> because of the lubricating residue on the boards. I'm curious if it's more >>>>> UV resistant (or at least the adhesive would be) and therefore survive the >>>>> endless sun bathing better. Also, the concept of cutting fabric into >>>>> strips >>>>> and using spray adhesive as a backing gives the user many more options >>>>> when >>>>> it comes to materials (stronger fabric and/or stronger glue), rather than >>>>> just limiting to such a rare find as 6" BFT. Though I'm sure that sport >>>>> nylon "tape" is even more rare. You can also make the strips as wide as >>>>> you >>>>> want, so you are not limited there either. >>>>> >>>>> I've built a prototype of a hinged triangle using foamcore, sport >>>>> nylon and Super 77, which seems very, very strong. Stronger than masking >>>>> tape anyway. I'm thinking that while it's not waterproof out of the box, I >>>>> could always spray with some scotchguard, or tape over everything with the >>>>> foil tape. Foil tape would also help any concerns on fire-hazard as the >>>>> adhesive is quite flammable. I put a hairdrier on it for about 10 mins on >>>>> high, to see if excessive heat made the glue loosen, but it did quite >>>>> well. >>>>> I'm thinking the higher temp ratings of 80 or 90 adhesive will help in >>>>> that >>>>> area. Maybe instead of foil tape. I can spray with some sort of coating >>>>> that will protect against fire and water at the same time. >>>>> >>>>> For cost comparison, my project would be using about 6 rolls of 60yd >>>>> tape. That's about $20 a roll. Plus about 4 rolls of foil tape (for >>>>> outside >>>>> only) at another $20 a roll. I'm thinking that a can of adhesive will last >>>>> quite a long time, so I may only need about 3 cans at about $20 a pop. The >>>>> fabric is not that expensive (maybe 5 dollars a yard), so I think all in >>>>> all, I might come out saving a little cash (if any at all), but ending up >>>>> with a much more permanent/reusable solution. >>>>> >>>>> Anyway, what do you all think? I'm going to be purchasing a piece of >>>>> polyIso to test. I'm going to make a single "quad" using this nylon and >>>>> adhesive, then leaving it up on my roof for a week or two to see how it >>>>> handles the weather. It's Santa Monica CA weather so not quite the same, >>>>> but should give a good indication as to whether it will survive at all. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks for reading! >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "hexayurt" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/hexayurt. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "hexayurt" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/hexayurt. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "hexayurt" group. 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