It was a generalization, ive been on this list a long time and seen many people yell boycott.
and to Timothy If someone kept calling me to tell me how much I suck i would stop answering the phone wouldn't you? and to Karl this mail list was a support list for the windows version of hlds that is it, so unless you are offering help, asking for help, reporting bugs, or getting info about a patch you prob shouldn't be talking. That is how it was for many many years. Id be a happy man if everyone who went off topic were removed from the list. Saying that because I don't really want to prolong this topic i won't respond again, I only wanted to clear up what Sakefox said. Kingsley -------------------------------------------------- From: "SakeFox" <[email protected]> Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 7:51 AM To: "Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list" <[email protected]> Subject: Re: [hlds] Valve It's Time To Listen And Answer! --- they don't owe you anything. > Before you make your post on a subject, please read what was posted and > not just assume you read it all. There was never anyone screaming about > a boycott or alike. It sounds like your rant is more about other peoples > issues then the one that this topic was about. > > Kingsley Foreman wrote: >> I've stayed quiet on this one but seriously i'm sick of the spam. If you >> want to whine about Valve go create your own mail list and feel free to >> do >> it all you want. >> >> I know that many of you have been hosting servers for a long time, I also >> know many of you haven't im also assuming some people on this list aren't >> hosters at all. However little support from games companies from isn't >> something new, it has been going on size the first dedicated server was >> released. Valve traditionally are far far far better then most if not all >> companies on releasing patches and fixes. Anyone here heard of the >> Battlefield series of games? >> >> However this isn't the problem here, have any of you actually wondered if >> it >> is actually us as a whole who have caused the problem of valve "not >> listening". Ive been on this mail list for many many years, way before >> steam >> was released, back when CS was really the only game it talked about. The >> list was 1000x better then it is now. If there was a post it was us or >> someone helping someone else or a release. No crying that Valve don't >> love >> us, It was even before GSPs went on huge rants because a patch didn't do >> they wanted and it was costing them money. >> >> Back then Valve responded to most if not all problems. Why because when >> they >> did everyone said thank you and didn't scream boycott and cry foul. >> People >> get over it. Valve are a business, Valve of course want sales, they same >> way >> you do. We aren't valves customers if anything most of you are using >> something Valve give out for free to make money. >> >> And on a final note, i love people who scream boycott, why? because when >> you >> do it mean more player for us when when we ignore it. >> >> I'm actually more annoyed at the people on the list who have changed it >> into >> what it is today rather then a useful list like it used to be. I don't >> care >> about your business, what upsets you at night, how the world is out to >> get >> you, or your dick size. I care about patches and fixes with people >> willing >> to contribute to make something better, not whinge about why it isn't. So >> for the people working out bugs, making mods, and generally helping >> others, >> I salute you. For the rest maybe you should start a blog. >> >> On a final note, If you tell someone they are shit at playing catch every >> time they come round to play catch, eventually they will stop coming >> around. >> That is what valve has done. >> >> PS. yes I do feel bad about contributing to this tripe. >> >> Kingsley >> >> -------------------------------------------------- >> From: "Jon" <[email protected]> >> Sent: Friday, January 09, 2009 2:43 AM >> To: "Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list" >> <[email protected]> >> Subject: Re: [hlds] Valve It's Time To Listen And Answer! >> >> >>> Agreed! >>> >>> Jon >>> >>> ________________________________________ >>> From: [email protected] >>> [[email protected]] On Behalf Of Kveri >>> [[email protected]] >>> Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 2:07 PM >>> To: Half-Life dedicated Win32 server mailing list >>> Subject: Re: [hlds] Valve It's Time To Listen And Answer! >>> >>> I agree. >>> >>> Kveri >>> >>> Blood Letter wrote / napísal(a): >>> >>>> If Valve completely ignores server operators who provide free servers, >>>> without which their games would be useless, they suck. >>>> >>>> If Valve lets long standing bugs, exploits, and security issues go >>>> unattended while focusing only on the latest content update + free >>>> weekend, they clearly prioritize sales over customers. >>>> >>>> I don't know about Valve's office, but if something goes wrong with a >>>> system at my office, even on Christmas day, we respond to it, and come >>>> into the office if necessary. If there are fires wreaking havoc with >>>> the >>>> power grid and people are being evacuated from their homes, we >>>> coordinate >>>> to make sure our servers are backed up, the backups are offsite, and >>>> the >>>> servers are safe. >>>> >>>> If someone at Valve wants a break, they can take vacation days. Do >>>> they >>>> only have 3 guys, and each only does 1 thing? I hope not. Any company >>>> worth it's salt knows you need redundancy in your mind share. >>>> >>>> Valve IS ignoring this list, by not replying. They get torn apart >>>> because they never respond to important issues, they're always late, >>>> and >>>> they never, EVER, provide clear and complete answers, let alone any >>>> semblance of documentation. >>>> >>>> Even if I were a child, I would still be a paying customer. If you're >>>> saying Valve gets a pass because gaming is not a priority in life, then >>>> you don't understand a single thing about having a job. If your job is >>>> to make games, you do that. If your job is to deliver mail, you do >>>> that. >>>> Working in a particular job sector does not give you the right to >>>> slack >>>> off. >>>> >>>> If Valve fixes everything and provides complete and correct >>>> documentation, then they get support and sales. Going from an F to an >>>> A >>>> doesn't change the fact that you still had an F. >>>> >>>> No one is treating Valve like shit. We are simply demanding we get >>>> some >>>> support, some documentation, and some communication. We get none of >>>> those things. Being a customer DOES give you the right to expect a >>>> certain level of quality and service from the business you are >>>> patronizing. >>>> >>>> If Valve's priorities continue to diverge from what so many of us >>>> expect, >>>> that's fine. They'll just lose our money and our support. Let's be >>>> clear here - server admins are supporting Valve, not the other way >>>> around. I'm sorry I can't apply for a job at Valve, I already have a >>>> job >>>> of my own. I can't be programming for everyone in the world, can I? >>>> Regardless, I wouldn't want to work in an office where a complete lack >>>> of >>>> customer support gets a passing grade. >>>> >>>> Valve's lack of support and communication is indefensible to anyone >>>> with >>>> even a remote knowledge of programming and software development. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> Date: Tue, 6 Jan 2009 11:12:41 -0500 >>>>> From: [email protected] >>>>> To: [email protected] >>>>> Subject: Re: [hlds] Valve It's Time To Listen And Answer! >>>>> >>>>> If Valve doesn't do everything we say, they suck. If Valve doesn't >>>>> fix >>>>> everything now, they suck. If Valve doesn't kiss our asses every >>>>> second >>>>> of >>>>> every day, they suck. They don't care, they won't fix this, they >>>>> refuse >>>>> to >>>>> fix that. All they want is our money. >>>>> >>>>> You all sound like a broken record. And worse than that, you have no >>>>> lives >>>>> outside of this thing we have here. Did anyone stop to think that >>>>> since >>>>> they all busted their asses for who knows how long getting Left 4 Dead >>>>> out >>>>> the door, while providing updates to TF2 the whole time, that >>>>> maybe...just >>>>> maybe, they'd want to take a break for a little while during the >>>>> holidays? >>>>> You know...so they could spend time with their families. >>>>> >>>>> Honestly, since release of TOB, there have been a relentless amount of >>>>> updates to their products. In the time that has passed from TOB until >>>>> now, >>>>> the only people being neglected were probably most of the families of >>>>> Valve >>>>> employees. Does anyone feel they deserve a little break? >>>>> >>>>> They're ignoring us? Really? You think so? Does anyone here >>>>> subscribe >>>>> to >>>>> HLCoders? A little civility goes a long way. In my opinion, Valve >>>>> isn't >>>>> ignoring this list, they just don't want to reply. I swear, this list >>>>> = >>>>> SPUF sometimes. Any two words they say are held against them forever. >>>>> >>>>> I know that a lot of kids subscribe to this list, so it would be >>>>> difficult >>>>> for a lot of you to understand, but there is such a thing as >>>>> priorities >>>>> in >>>>> life. Gaming is not as high on that list once you have a family to >>>>> take >>>>> care of and a boss to answer to. And you are not the boss of anyone >>>>> at >>>>> Valve. >>>>> >>>>> Valve knows about the problems, obviously. You all keep saying the >>>>> same >>>>> things over and over. Give them a break. Just because you didn't >>>>> have >>>>> anything to do for the past couple of weeks doesn't mean they had to >>>>> sit >>>>> around and hop on every little problem we have. What happens when >>>>> updates >>>>> are released to address the current existing issues? Are you going to >>>>> apologize for acting like a bunch of assholes or are you going to feel >>>>> stupid for saying things like, "Valve doesn't care about their games >>>>> anymore"? Wait...I know. 90% of you will say, "Finally." 5% won't >>>>> be >>>>> happy no matter what. 4% will bring up another issue that Valve is >>>>> ignoring. And 1% will say, "Thank you." >>>>> >>>>> Yes, we paid money for the game. But $50 does not give you the right >>>>> to >>>>> treat the people trying to help you like shit. Sometimes the problems >>>>> that >>>>> you claim are easy fixes may not be so easy to fix. And since most of >>>>> you >>>>> know for a fact that it's an easy fix, there's always >>>>> [email protected] >>>>> . >>>>> >>>>> Grow up. They are aware of the problems. Like Aaron said, there are >>>>> your >>>>> priorities and then there are business priorities. Just because the >>>>> issues >>>>> high on your list may not be high on theirs doesn't mean they're >>>>> ignoring >>>>> you. But then, it would be stupid of me to assume that most of you >>>>> would >>>>> understand any of that, especially given your attitudes over the past >>>>> few >>>>> months. >>>>> >>>>> -Richard Eid >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>>>> please visit: >>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds >>>>> >>>>> >>>> _________________________________________________________________ >>>> It’s the same Hotmail®. If by “same” you mean up to 70% faster. >>>> http://windowslive.com/online/hotmail?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_hotmail_acq_broad1_122008 >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>>> please visit: >>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>> please visit: >>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds >>> _______________________________________________ >>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>> please visit: >>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds >>> >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >> please visit: >> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds >> >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > _______________________________________________ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
