Imo the most disturbing is that there are popular no steam servers that are on the lists.
how can i report them? On 3 Nov 2011 16:23, "Frank" <[email protected]> wrote: > I don't think this mailing list is the place to post server names, admins, > owners and whoever...it was never its intentions to use it as such as this > whole discussion could have been carried out on the official TF2 forums or > just use the contact us page. Constantly I see posts like this getting > stuck > in the middle of server issue posts that I need or like to read which is > the > reason I signed up for the list in the first place. > > Again if you have issues with a server you don't like either stop playing > on > them or use the proper channels as they've gave you or even those other > two. > There are currently about 6000 servers to play on and this is what I saw in > the middle of the day...I find it hard to believe if you have an issue with > one you can't find another to play on that better suits your needs and > addresses you're complaints with how its managed. > > Remember at the end of the day: It's still just a game. > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of coffee > problem > Sent: Thursday, November 03, 2011 2:12 AM > To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list > Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Fake clients, misreported bots, infringing usage > of player names/images > > Yeah, there appears to be a missing post now. But hey, what's to be > expected > from operations that try to trick users? > > On Thu, Nov 3, 2011 at 1:04 AM, Brian Simon <[email protected] > >wrote: > > > I see no posts by any Lotusclan administrators in that thread you > > linked to. Also, did you know that Skial does not actually delete > > threads and ban users for talking about bots? There's really no > > credibility or proof behind either of your examples there. > > > > One more thing, Lotus Clan does not masquerade bots as players, just > > fyi > > > > On Wed, Nov 2, 2011 at 11:45 PM, coffee problem > > <[email protected] > > >wrote: > > > > > Hey Fletcher, Thanks for your reply. I have much appreciation for > > > Valve > > at > > > least saying this is wrong. When I've contacted admins for a few > > > communities, they said they would stop if Valve said to do so. This > > > seems to be a clear message to cease these activities. > > > > > > http://forums.gamingterritory.com/topic/15515-are-bots-really-necess > > > ary/ > > > > > > There you go, LotusClan administration admitting they use these > > > types of misleading bots to pump up server stats because "they have to > do it". > > > Please do what you guys need to do, since the reporting tool has yet > > > to lead to anything. Skial likes to delete all threads and ban users > > > associated with the discussion of their bots and misleading > > > activities, > > so > > > not so much evidence there.. Yet. > > > > > > CP > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Nov 2, 2011 at 2:50 PM, Fletcher Dunn > > > <[email protected]>wrote: > > > > > > > This is a problem we're obviously aware of. It's definitely not > > > > that > > we > > > > don't care. However, it is essentially an arms race that is > > > > provably unwinnable by Valve. Furthermore, any change we make in > > > > the name of security will almost certainly cause a disruption of > > > > legitimate > > service, > > > > due to bugs on our part, or usage cases we're just not aware of. > > > > It > > is a > > > > classic conflict between security and accessibility. > > > > > > > > Hopefully those two reasons help explain our reluctance to address > > these > > > > sorts of problems through technology. They will create an ongoing > > > > arms race, in which we can possibly limit this activity and make > > > > it harder, > > > but > > > > probably never eliminate it completely. Furthermore, this benefit > > comes > > > at > > > > a cost of taking resources away from adding features and fixing > > > > bugs, > > and > > > > also disrupting legitimate users. > > > > > > > > When we can do simple and safe things to make it harder to do > > > > these > > sorts > > > > of things, we will. We have some protocol changes that will make > > > > it > > > harder > > > > to do this sort of spoofing, which have been beta tested for some > > > > time > > > now. > > > > We'll be rolling those out in the next couple of months. > > > > > > > > Crowdsourcing using the abuse reports helps us stay out of the > > > > arms > > race, > > > > and it's the safest and simplest way to deal with this problem and > > > > many others like it. > > > > > > > > Your humble servant, > > > > Fletch > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: [email protected] [mailto: > > > > [email protected]] On Behalf Of Mart-Jan > > > Reeuwijk > > > > Sent: Wednesday, November 02, 2011 5:39 AM > > > > To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list > > > > Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Fake clients, misreported bots, > > > > infringing > > > usage > > > > of player names/images > > > > > > > > there is some italian group that does that. > > > > > > > > they have dozens maybe even in the hundred of servers in server > > > > list, > > but > > > > all get redirected to 1 server. and those server report a variety > > > > of > > maps > > > > played, names in server lists etc. you click info, refresh, says > > > > for example dustbowl, and then join, get redirected to their > > > > server, with > > > bots, > > > > and another map then advertized in the server info. Its damn > annoying. > > > And > > > > indeed, they change IP's a lot, to evade blacklisting. > > > > > > > > > > > > >________________________________ > > > > >From: daniel jokiaho <[email protected]> > > > > >To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list < > > > > [email protected]> > > > > >Sent: Wednesday, 2 November 2011, 7:27 > > > > >Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Fake clients, misreported bots, > > > > >infringing > > > > usage of player names/images > > > > > > > > > >what about servers on different ips and port that have exactly > > > > >the > > same > > > > >players. > > > > > > > > > >I join server x. U join server y. And still we play against or > > > > >with > > each > > > > >other :-( > > > > >On 2 Nov 2011 06:53, "msleeper" <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > >> Are you sure they're not just adding more servers? Changing IPs > > > > >> is a server playerbase suicide as anyone who had it bookmarked > > > > >> won't be able to find it again. I suppose they could use those > > > > >> servers for redirects, but in theory that would get those IPs > > > > >> blacklisted pretty fast if Valve's scoring/reputation system is > still in effect. > > > > >> > > > > >> On Wed, Nov 2, 2011 at 1:42 AM, Jesse Porter > > > > >> <[email protected] > > > > > > > >> wrote: > > > > >> > The problem with blacklisting these servers is that they seem > > > > >> > to > > > show > > > > up > > > > >> a > > > > >> > few weeks later with a new batch of ip addresses. Can't > > > > >> > blacklist > > > them > > > > >> > effectively when they do that. > > > > >> > On Nov 1, 2011 7:40 PM, "Robert Paulson" > > > > >> > <[email protected]> > > > > wrote: > > > > >> > > > > > >> >> It is very rude of you to repeatedly spam the mailing list > > > > >> >> to > > > > pressure > > > > >> >> Valve into doing whatever you want instead of working on > > > > >> >> crashes > > > and > > > > >> >> content. > > > > >> >> > > > > >> >> Valve has already put in a huge effort making these servers > > > > >> >> less > > > > >> prominent. > > > > >> >> > > > > >> >> - Blacklist > > > > >> >> - Quickplay > > > > >> >> - Reputation > > > > >> >> > > > > >> >> It isn't perfect but blacklisting takes care of the servers > > > > >> >> you > > > don't > > > > >> like > > > > >> >> once you've spotted them. Quickplay and reputation filter > > > > >> >> most of > > > the > > > > >> ones > > > > >> >> you haven't spotted yet. No one I know has any problems > > > > >> >> finding a > > > > server > > > > >> >> full of real players. Everyone I know just blacklists and > > > > >> >> move > > on. > > > > >> >> > > > > >> >> Server IPs do not change often since it costs money to buy > > > > >> >> new > > ones > > > > and > > > > >> you > > > > >> >> need proper ARIN justification to get more due to the IPV4 > > > shortage. > > > > The > > > > >> >> fact that you are on here spamming about it as though TF2 is > > going > > > to > > > > >> die > > > > >> >> out next week makes me think that you are struggling with > > > > >> >> your > > own > > > > >> server > > > > >> >> rather than being a concerned player. > > > > >> >> > > > > >> >> I also hate the big pay-to-win servers with fake clients, > > > > >> >> but it > > > > would > > > > >> be a > > > > >> >> mistake for Valve to just de-list them, wrongly assuming no > > > > >> >> one > > > > really > > > > >> >> wants to play there. I have a friend who wouldn't be playing > > > > >> >> TF2 > > if > > > > they > > > > >> >> didn't exist and has bought hundreds of dollars worth of > > > > >> >> Mann Co > > > > keys. > > > > >> And > > > > >> >> from what he tells me he isn't the only one. Yes he knows > > > > >> >> there > > are > > > > >> bots. > > > > >> >> The "cloaked" bots appeal to him for the same reason Valve > > decided > > > > not > > > > >> to > > > > >> >> name bots bot1, bot2, bot3 and to have them taunt randomly. > > > > >> >> > > > > >> >> These servers still exist not because of a fake player > > > > >> >> plugin but > > > > >> because, > > > > >> >> as much as it pains us to believe, some players actually > > > > >> >> prefer > > > them. > > > > >> >> > > > > >> >> No one here is enthusiastic about having Valve delist > > > > >> >> servers > > based > > > > on > > > > >> >> anonymous reports because we all know that the system will > > > > >> >> be > > > abused > > > > >> even > > > > >> >> though they have "taken basic measures to prevent" it. We > > > > >> >> know > > this > > > > >> because > > > > >> >> they also took "measures" to prevent F2P players from > > > > >> >> avoiding > > VAC > > > > bans > > > > >> by > > > > >> >> making throw-away accounts, yet I still see hackers that > > > > >> >> have > > made > > > at > > > > >> least > > > > >> >> 5 of them in a row and even adding their old VAC banned > > > > >> >> account > > on > > > > their > > > > >> >> friends list. > > > > >> >> > > > > >> >> To save Valve the administration overhead and abuse, and to > > satisfy > > > > both > > > > >> >> server administrators and players, I suggest dropping the > > > > >> >> server > > > > report > > > > >> >> function and adding either of these 2 features. > > > > >> >> > > > > >> >> 1. Add a check-box for Valve-only/Favorites-only Quickplay > > servers. > > > > >> >> > > > > >> >> 2. Let premium players rate servers from 1 to 5 upon > > disconnection. > > > > Each > > > > >> >> player may only vote once. To prevent voter apathy, servers > > > > >> >> are automatically rated a 5 if the player does not vote. > > > > >> >> Then the > > user > > > > can > > > > >> >> decide for him/herself to connect to the server based on the > > rating > > > > >> rather > > > > >> >> than a few opinionated complainers. > > > > >> >> > > > > >> >> These two solutions address the root of the problem and lets > > > > >> >> the > > > > player > > > > >> >> decide while freeing Valve to work on more content. > > > > >> >> _______________________________________________ > > > > >> >> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > > > > archives, > > > > >> >> please visit: > > > > >> >> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > > > >> >> > > > > >> > _______________________________________________ > > > > >> > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > > > archives, > > > > >> please visit: > > > > >> > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> _______________________________________________ > > > > >> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > > archives, > > > > >> please visit: > > > > >> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > > > >> > > > > >_______________________________________________ > > > > >To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > > > > >archives, > > > > please visit: > > > > >http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > > > > archives, please visit: > > > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > > > > archives, please visit: > > > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > > > archives, please visit: > > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > > > > > > ducks > > _______________________________________________ > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > > please visit: > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > > _______________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > > > _______________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > please visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux > _______________________________________________ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
