> 5. The truth is that larger servers are popular, but quickplay is too much > of an advantage. Valve has the data to confirm this, and will be doing a > disservice to themselves by penalizing them at a time when MvM is running > out of steam to keep TF2 popular. If larger servers were not popular, > people wouldn't keep joining, and thus it is a self-correcting problem. I can confirm that after the update to the tags rule, one of our 32 player servers went from being completely full 90% of the time (with player activity 100% of the time--never any downtime) and being ranked in the top 5 on gametracker, to 55th in about a week. It is now typically empty between 2am and noon until we can round up the regulars to the point that there's ~20 people online for quickplay to kick in again. That is /a lot/ of players being impacted, considering I'm sure there are many other 32 player servers experiencing the same thing.
I do agree that most maps are best played with 24 players, but there are some where 32-players make the map even more fun. Honestly, I wouldn't play dustbowl on a 24-player server, and I spend about 90% of my game time on dustbowl. Other people feel the same way about 2fort (the 32-player version of 2fort is immensely popular). If all these bigger servers start to die off due to quickplay penalties, I know quite a few people who will start playing significantly less. This is an important issue that needs to be solved ASAP. If you want some actual data on slot differences of servers, I've compiled a week's worth on the top-400 servers here: http://www.ranndesigns.com/blog/team-fortress-2-map-data/. Take a look at the server capacity by players in the second set of graphs. On average, the 32-player servers were at a much higher percentage of full-capacity than the 24-playser servers. On 3/6/2013 6:47 PM, Robert Paulson wrote: > It seems like people on the internet have issues reading (what a big > surprise), so I am going to try to keep this as short as possible. > > I am repeating myself because I have problems with people in this mailing > list not even playing TF2 anymore trying to ruin other people's favorite > settings. And it is funny seeing 24-slot server owners trying anything to > get their competitors banned. You know who you are. > > 1. Servers were mistakenly banned for a mistake on Valve's part. They did > not know that changing sv_visiblemaxplayers after startup does not set a > tag. Anyone that changed this setting was banned because Valve thought it > set a tag but it didn't. This includes unarguably legitimate uses like > reserved slots. Thus the bans were rightfully removed. > > 2. Fletcher himself said "But it’s not ban worthy *and I think it’d be > straying into a grey area on our part to take action against it." > > 3. In no first world country has anyone ever been convicted for not > following the "spirit of the law". > > 4. The root of the problem is that quickplay is Valve's backhanded way to > get the community to accept the "custom tabs" ghetto under the premise that > quickplay is only for a few noobs. Anyone that actually runs a server can > tell you that having quickplay will make or break any server close to > vanilla. Remove the penalty so servers can compete EQUALLY as it should > have been, or have an opt-in for 24 slots only. > > 5. The truth is that larger servers are popular, but quickplay is too much > of an advantage. Valve has the data to confirm this, and will be doing a > disservice to themselves by penalizing them at a time when MvM is running > out of steam to keep TF2 popular. If larger servers were not popular, > people wouldn't keep joining, and thus it is a self-correcting problem. > > Get rid of this quickplay penalty and level the playing field. TF2 was made > in 2007 computers can handle more than 24 slots now. > > 6. The quickplay FAQ says > > Are there any server side mods that will disqualify me from Quickplay since > some do not change sv_tags? No, we are not automatically disqualifying > servers for server side mods. If the mods results in a better or worse > player experience, that will be reflected in the back-end server score. > > So whatever happened to this? If Valve is banning servers from quickplay > for changing sv_visiblemaxplayers, then I would request Fletcher to also > remove the following: > > - Reserved slots: Ruins my vanilla experience by getting randomly kicked. > - Donation benefits: Ruins my vanilla experience when I can't kill donators > end of round or have autobalance immunity. I already paid Valve and those > hat modelers, why do server owners have the audacity to ask me for any more > of my money? > - Class limits: I don't care if my team has 10 snipers. If I can't play a > class, it isn't a vanilla experience. > - Alltalk: I really need to strategize with quickplay noobs, and alltalk > ruins my vanilla experience. > - Ability to change maps: As a player, I am entitled to an accurate > indication that the servers I am sent to only has quickplay maps or that > the map doesn't switch right after I join. > > F*ck these server owners right? Who the do they think they are ruining the > way I want to play TF2? This is satire if you couldn't tell. All I see here > is a constant erosion of the rights of server owners. Valve penalizing > larger servers while letting pay-to-win servers off the hook is a sad > perversion of priorities. > > On Wed, Mar 6, 2013 at 2:01 PM, Rudy Bleeker <rblee...@gmail.com> wrote: > >> I kinda hoped this thread was over, but apparently it's not. In that >> case let me chip in as well. I also kind of agree with Dan. It's all >> about the difference between the exact wording of the rules and their >> intention. Some people on here would do well to read up on that, so >> for your convenience: >> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Letter_and_spirit_of_the_law >> >> In this case I think it's clear that with the quickplay system Valve >> intended to give Team Fortress 2 players a predictable and constant >> game experience. So farming the quickplay system for traffic to your >> server and then changing that server to something that's not eligible >> for quickplay is wrong, no matter how the rules were written. I >> sincerely hope this practice will stop and that the servers in >> question will be banned (again). >> >> On Wed, Mar 6, 2013 at 9:55 PM, Game-Over <gameover.serv...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >>> I have to say I'm with Dan on this one, and he often seems to stand >> alone, >>> so I felt I had to say something. >>> >>> Having monitored this group for nearly 2 years, I have come to the >>> conclusion that it is mostly populated >>> by youngsters, who have no life experience to speak of. The excuses used >>> here by some that "Valve never >>> said we couldn't do this" or "there's nothing in the rules that say we >> can't >>> do this", leads me to believe that >>> they rely on parents to tell them when they are doing wrong and they >> simply >>> can't work it out for themselves. >>> >>> This latest trend of using a plugin to switch on Quickplay up to 24 >> players, >>> and then when at 24/24 switch off Quickplay >>> and convert the server to 32 players, instaspawn, with the argument that >>> "tell us where we are breaking the Policy of >>> Truth rules", is quite frankly mind boggling. Lets just forget about >> those >>> players who thought they were joining a >>> stock TF2 server and who end up with 24/7 32 man 2fort spammage, because >>> it's fine as Valve never said that >>> using this particular plugin this was wrong. No Heroes (cough). >>> >>> I blame Pinion as it has opened the gates for children to run servers. >> Good >>> old fashioned honesty, decency and integrity, >>> not to mention thinking of the players and not your pockets. You learn >> these >>> things as adults. >>> >>> Why Valve backtracked on their latest purge of bans is beyond me. They >> have >>> lost their backbone and I'm extremely >>> disappointed. I hope they find their backbone again soon. >>> >>> >>> On 06/03/2013 20:11, dan wrote: >>>> On 06/03/2013 18:18, Gordon Reynolds wrote: >>>>> I'm glad we decided to take the high road here and didn't resort to >>>>> calling >>>>> each other scumbags based on how they want to run their video game >> server >>>>> :) >>>> >>>> Yeah his was such an erudite and polite message. >>>> Sheesh. >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >>> please visit: >>> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >> >> >> -- >> Idleness is not doing nothing. Idleness is being free to do anything. >> - Floyd Dell >> >> _______________________________________________ >> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, >> please visit: >> https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux >> > _______________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please > visit: > https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux -- Jake Forrester Freelance Web Developer/Designer & Joomla Enthusiast e: j...@ranndesigns.com _______________________________________________ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: https://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
