Maybe it's a semantics thing. For me the word *pitch* implies the actual note value we place on a certain frequency, i.e. A=440 or in this case the label E flat for the 5000 Hz pitch.
I interpret Hans's statements in the line of "we can hear sounds above 5000 Hz but can not accurately say when we hear a note that high whether it's a C, an E flat or an F sharp" Which is correct, it's the way the nerves between ear and brain work. We *can* distinguish between different frequencies that high, (which is probably what you're saying) but we can not extract useful musical information out of them (which is what Hans is saying). On Fri, Nov 12, 2010 at 09:45, <[email protected]> wrote: > That is QUITE different from saying "we can neither hear nor distinguish > pitches above 5000Hz" (what Hans said). > > In fact - that's in line with what I have been saying all along. > > -William > > > In a message dated 11/12/2010 2:40:23 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, > [email protected] writes: > > Sure we can hear above 5000 Hz unless there is severe hearing damage. > It is however very hard to discern and name actual *pitches* in and above > that region. The way our neurons pass the information to our brain only > functions optimally up to 5000 Hz. > > http://www.newmusicbox.org/article.nmbx?id=4077 > > > > On Fri, Nov 12, 2010 at 00:43, <[email protected]> wrote: > > > You're right, how foolish of me to base my opinions on facts... > > > > -William > > > > > > In a message dated 11/11/2010 12:56:27 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, > > [email protected] writes: > > > > It´s theory that humans are able to hear pitches up to 20.000 Hz, but > very > > few do it. > > Just feeling it or just noticing it is not enough. I talked about > > distinguishing a certain > > pitch. That makes the difference. > > > > And, aren´t there surveys about hearing abilities in our societies ? > > Didn´t they > > come out telling us, that the hearing abilities not only of the > elderly > > are fading out, but > > also of the younger & the very young generations as being exposed to > the > > acoustical > > pollution or self imposed extreme noise high & sublow with high > amplitudes > > ??? > > > > Please, William, do not start another war of words, as we do not > disagree > > on the matter, > > but we view it from different standpoints only. You go for the mere > facts, > > perhaps, while > > I go for the qualities of the hearing sense, perhaps. > > > > ################################################################### > > Am 11.11.2010 um 18:32 schrieb [email protected]: > > > > > It's not theory. You either hear the pitches or you do not. Hearing > > tests > > > are pretty objective. You are given a range of frequencies for both > ears > > and > > > you either hear them or do you don't. > > > > > > I can not only hear pitches above 5,000 hz, but I can distinguish > > whether > > > or not I'm hearing them. > > > > > > -William > > > > > > > > > In a message dated 11/11/2010 11:13:01 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, > > > [email protected] writes: > > > > > > In theory, just in theory. But you cannot hear nor distinguish a > > certain > > > pitch above 5.000 Hz. > > > > > > And a greater majority of all people in our westernized society has > > severe > > > hearing loss. > > > > > > But I admit, you might feel the extreme high pitches, - even painful > in > > > > > your ear, or the extreme > > > low pitches in your stomache - can make you vomiting. > > > > > > > ######################################################################## > > > Am 11.11.2010 um 17:53 schrieb [email protected]: > > > > > >> The human ear can usually hear from 20Hz to 20,000Hz. > > >> > > >> If you cannot hear above 5,000 Hz, then you probably have severe > > hearing > > > > > >> loss. > > >> > > >> _ > http://www.noiseaddicts.com/2009/03/can-you-hear-this-hearing-test/_ > > >> > (http://www.noiseaddicts.com/2009/03/can-you-hear-this-hearing-test/) > > >> > > >> I have only halfway decent speakers - so I probably can't output > the > > > higher > > >> frequencies. I made it to 12kHz only. It must be all that time > near > > > large > > >> computer equipment, or my speakers. > > >> > > >> -William > > >> > > >> > > >> In a message dated 11/11/2010 10:48:20 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, > > >> [email protected] writes: > > >> > > >> Hello Hans Illich, > > >> > > >> good calculation, > > >> but A-5000 corresponds to a 4-times smaller E-flat 0,44% sharp, > > >> if we take A=440 as the base. > > >> > > >> Based upon A=440: E-flat=311,13 > > >> the corresponding fraction of 5000 be 312,50 which is 0,44% > sharp. > > >> This E-flat near 5000 Hz would be 22Hz sharp and be in the 5th > > octave > > > = > > >> E-flat´´´´´ > > >> thus exceeding most peoples hearing capabilities. > > >> > > >> Or explained musically: > > >> two octaves higher than the notated high E-flat, written with 3 > > ledger > > >> lines above staff > > >> in concert notation (=sound as written). It might be notated as > > trebble > > >> clef plus "octava 2" above > > >> or similar. > > >> > > >> It would also mean, that A-5000 does not exist, if we go after > human > > >> naming of pitches. > > >> > > >> Mei liawa ! Oba bist guad im kalkulian. Liawe griass > > >> > > >> ############################################################### > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> post: [email protected] > > >> unsubscribe or set options at https://pegasus > > >> .memphis.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/options/horn/valkhorn%40aol.com > > >> _______________________________________________ > > >> post: [email protected] > > >> unsubscribe or set options at > > > > > > https://pegasus.memphis.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/options/horn/hpizka%40me.com > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > post: [email protected] > > > unsubscribe or set options at > > > > > https://pegasus.memphis.edu > /cgi-bin/mailman/options/horn/valkhorn%40aol.com > > > _______________________________________________ > > > post: [email protected] > > > unsubscribe or set options at > > > https://pegasus.memphis.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/options/horn/hpizka%40me.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > > post: [email protected] > > unsubscribe or set options at > > > https://pegasus.memphis.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/options/horn/valkhorn%40aol.com > > _______________________________________________ > > post: [email protected] > > unsubscribe or set options at > > > > https://pegasus.memphis.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/options/horn/corbasse%40gmail.com > > > _______________________________________________ > post: [email protected] > unsubscribe or set options at > https://pegasus.memphis.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/options/horn/valkhorn%40aol.com > _______________________________________________ > post: [email protected] > unsubscribe or set options at > https://pegasus.memphis.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/options/horn/corbasse%40gmail.com > _______________________________________________ post: [email protected] unsubscribe or set options at https://pegasus.memphis.edu/cgi-bin/mailman/options/horn/archive%40jab.org
