Hi!

I am also interested in following this thread.  We had some discussion about it 
on this list in June 2006; following is part of a post I made then.

Very best regards,

-Gary P. (in rural northern Illinois near Marengo, between Elgin and Rockford 
IL)

Gary Plazyk, [email protected]
Fuzzy Bear Farm
http://profiles.yahoo.com/g_plazyk
http://www.BearCreekMusic.us
http://www.RavenswoodMorris.org

"Music is too important to leave to the professionals." -Robert Shaw


-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: [HG] Hurdy gurdies in American Civil War?
Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2006 11:05:41 -0500
From: Gary F. Plazyk <[email protected]>
Reply-To: [email protected]
To: [email protected]

Hi!
...
[Omitted:  discussion of the hurdy gurdy in the 1937 movie _Captains 
Courageous_ starring Spencer Tracy]
...

*** I did some further searching on Google (search term "hurdy gurdy" "New 
Orleans"), and found a few promising lines of research.  In the Lark in the 
Morning web site's history of the Hurdy Gurdy ( 
http://larkinthemorning.com/article.asp?AI=41&bhcd2=1151589961 ), they mention:
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Meanwhile, the hurdy gurdy has come to the United States, no doubt in the hands 
of traveling Frenchmen. It is said that around 1850, there were a few hurdy 
gurdys being played in New Orleans. There is mention of one in New York about 
around 1940. There is an early California dance tune discovered in Watsonville, 
California, which is actually a French tune called La Valso-vienne. No one 
knows how it originally arrived from France. A friend of mine remembers a man 
coming to town with his hurdy gurdy back in the Oklahoma oil days. Any 
information on the use of the hurdy gurdy in the United States which anyone 
would like to share with us is welcomed.
...
BIBLIOGRAPHY:
BAINES, ANTHONY, European & American Musical Instruments, The Viking Press, New 
York, 1966
BROCKER, MARIANNE, The Hurdy Gurdy, Archiv Productions, Hanover Germany, 1972
D'ALBERT, ARRIGO, Mendocino, California
JENKINS, JEAN, Eighteenth Century Musical Instruments: France and Britain, 
Thanet Press, London, 1973
LEPPERT, RICHARD D., Arcadia at Versailles, Swets & Zeitlinger B.V., Amsterdam, 
1978
MUNROW, DAVID, Instruments of the Middle Ages and Renaissance, Oxford 
University Press, London, 1976
MARCUSE, SIBYL, Musical Instruments: A Comprehensive Dictionary, W.W. Norton & 
Co., New York, 1975
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

*** In The Strange Life of the Hurdy Gurdy and other Tales ( 
http://www.exulanten.com/hurdy.html ), there is an interesting connection 
between California and Australia gold rush saloon dancing girls and the hurdy 
gurdy.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
...
The hurdy-gurdy is a string instrument that produces sound similar to a 
bagpipe. The continuous sound is produced by the action of a rotating wheel, 
turned by a hand crank, rubbing against strings, just as violin strings are 
sounded by a bow being drawn across them. Some think that the instrument was 
imported from France by the Ukrainian Cossacks who took part in The Thirty 
Years War, but others think it originated in the northern part of Iberia some 
time prior to the eleventh century A.D., and still others have said it 
originated with the Moors. It has been around for a long time and has a 
colorful history.

An English decree from 1651 that travelling musicians had proper licenses. "The 
hurdygurdyists, both men and women should be removed completely so that we no 
longer need to see their vulgar and disorderly talk and gestures which the 
travelling musicians delight in cultivating together with other impertinances."

It fell from popularity for a time, then re-emerged as a popular novelty among 
the nobility in the 17th and 18th centuries, and older guitars and lutes were 
sometimes rebuilt into hurdy-gurdies. By the 18th century, Haydn wrote two 
concerti for the hurdy-gurdy, Mozart included it in a couple of pieces, and its 
use was later suggested in Schubert's piece "Der Leiermann." ("The Hurdy-Gurdy 
Player")

Then,there was the other definition of a Hurdy Gurdy. Poor Hessian farmers in 
the 1820s made wooden brooms and fly-whisks during the winter to sell in summer 
at nearby markets in the surrounding areas, and to increase sales they expanded 
into other German cities and town and eventually even to France and England. 
Then they found that their wares sold better if they brought along dancing 
girls who played the Hurdy Gurdy. This gave birth to a sort of 19th century 
"pimp" who would talk the parents of these young girls into letting them travel 
with him and entertain in dance halls on the promise they would send a fair 
portion of their earnings home.

The "Hurdy-Gurdy girls" and "Hessian Broom Girls" ended up all over the globe. 
Many travelled out to gold-rush California, others ended up in the Australia 
mining regions. By 1865, laws were passed in Germany to prevent the practise of 
enticing young girls into what was considered a debauch life,and the practise, 
at least in public, died out.
...
-----------------------------------------------------------------------


*** Following up on this, I checked the Dance History Archives at 
Streetswing.com ( http://www.streetswing.com/histclub/a1a.htm ), which 
documents all sorts of musical theatrical performances; they actually have a 
distinct category for hurdy gurdy.  If I'm reading their table correctly, they 
document hurdy gurdy performances at:
* the Alabam Night Club, Chicago IL, 1920's
* the Bird Cage Theater, Tombstone AZ, 1880
* La Paradis, Washington WA, 1920's
* Valentino's, New York NY, 1890's

There was a saloon called The Hurdy-Gurdy House in Virginia City MO.

"The Hurdy-Gurdy Girl" performed at the Wallack Theater in 1907.

There was a dance called the "Hurdy Gurdy", possibly originating in France in 
the 1850's associated with "Prostitution, Striptease, Hootchy Hootchi - 
Cootchi" [!]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------


*** The web site The Hurdy-Gurdy Girls ( http://www.hotpipes.com/hggirls2.html 
) has some pictures and the disreputable history of the association between 
hurdy gurdy and the American Gold Rush.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
In looking into all of this further, this writer finds it intereting that 
something so once-notorious and spectacular as this lengthy and widespread 
episode seems to have been largely overlooked or misunderstood by modern 
historians. For example Susann Palmer, in her excellent reference work "The 
Hurdy Gurdy" (David & Charles: London, 1980) bristles at the suggestion of 
hurdy-gurdies in dance halls; she writes, "A supplement to the Oxford English 
Dictionary (1976) humiliates the hurdy gurdy further ... it gives as ... used 
in North America: 'hurdy-gurdy girl, a dance hostess in a hurdy-gurdy house, 
being a disreputable type of cheap dance hall.' ... It is almost certain that 
these 'hurdy-gurdy houses' were places where mechanical barrel-organs were 
installed." (pp. 41-42). Meanwhile, we find the government of British Columbia, 
Canada exhibiting confusion on its web site dedicated to the gold rush there, 
not about the presence and nature of the hurdy-gurdy girls who came
there during the 1850s (see photo above), but about the meaning of the term 
"hurdy-gurdy" and the womens' relationship to the instrument. We at Nova Albion 
Research are continuing to look into this subject and will expand these 
comments as information is uncovered. We would also like to bring Kurt 
Reichmann's "Hurdy-Gurdy Girls" exhibition to North America, if suitable 
sponsorship can be found.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

This site highlights the confusion created by the fact that "hurdy gurdy" is 
commonly used to refer to at least three vastly different music producing 
mechanisms:
- the rotating bow on keyboard stopped stringed instrument we play
- the "organ grinder" music roll pipe or reed barrel organ
- the cranked music box


*** There's quite a treasure trove of references when you use the search terms 
"hurdy gurdy house" and "hurdy gurdy girl" - mostly references to saloons and 
houses of ill-repute!
http://www.idahostatesman.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060606/NEWS04/606060345/1037
http://www.phantomranch.net/folkdanc/articles/boysnite.htm
http://www.suite101.com/lesson.cfm/17161/609/7
http://www.umwestern.edu/Academics/library/libroth/MHD/vigilantes/DIMSDALE/chapters/chap1.html
http://www.rootsweb.com/~orgenweb/bios/jamespoindexter.html
http://www.bookideas.com/reviews/index.cfm?fuseaction=displayReview&id=1454
http://members.aol.com/Gibson0817/bbasin.htm
http://www.nevadaappeal.com/article/20060616/DAYTON/106160070


I would guess that there is good material here for a Master's Thesis on the 
history of the hurdy gurdy in North America.  I'm particularly intrigued by the 
assertions that the hurdy gurdy was used in Western saloons during the 
1840's-1880's.  (Does anybody have access to a Masters Thesis database?  Maybe 
somebody has already done this?)

-Gary P.


Also, here's a tantalizing comment from Sara Johnson:

Finally, of the Southern Appalachian Culture, Richard Trythall says:
"Respecting the traditional Celtic fondness - almost to the point of
exclusivity - for plucked and bowed string instruments, mountain musicians
gradually integrated  number of new string sounds into their music. Over the
course of the centuries, instruments such as the guitar, banjo (an
instrument of African origin), Hawaiian steel guitar (lap and pedal
versions), dobro, and string bass were added while, of course, the primacy
of the fiddle (the prima donna and "devil" of Celtic music)
and the use of other traditional stringed instruments of equally ancient
lineage such as the mountain dulcimer, the autoharp (developed from the
zither family), the mandolin (developed from the lute family), and the
ghironda (hurdy-gurdy) was continued."


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