--- Rick Hightower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> So Josh, let me get this straight if a Tapestry > project pays $1 dollar an > hour and a JSF project pays $100.00 an hour (or vice > versa), you would work > on the Tapestry project (or vice versa) because it > is a better fit. Hey Rick, thanks for the response. I would work on Tapestry project if I thought it would result in long term success of my client( if she wins i win ). As soon as you reduce development to a labor function it tends to compress the value that a good engineer can offer. I usually don't get into these kinds of situations... im more interested in developing specific ideas. What language they are based in is largely irrelevant. My interest in java is a function of my career legacy and thats about it these days. Sun faces some serious problems. > > The phrase "the one" refers to the project not the > technology. Hey, I hope you didnt take serious offense to my statement... > > Being a low-life contractor/consultant, I tend not > to pick the technology. well i would guess to some degree the technology picks you... you cant specialize in everything! > I really like working with Tapestry and JSF. Ive heard good things about Tapestry and it has LTC( Long Term Credibility- to use the microsoft term ). Good luck with that! > > > Since I am a consulting, I give advice, but will > > happily work with Tapestry > > or JSF. > > I've recommended Tapestry for some projects and JSF > for others. > > I am fairly open-minded. > > I would have no moral issue working on a dotNet > project or a RoR project. Well im not sure if youve encountered my commentary elsewhere, and this is a follow up on that... but anyway a summary on these two digital denizens: DOT NET: Arrrrrrghhhh! This is why i dont like Dot NET: Its like buying real estate in Columbia. I have no idea what will happen to my investment in time and resources. Microsoft has shown zero respect for thier customers( and America in general ) in the past despite Steve Ballmer's 'DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS DEVELOPERS' chant. I don't blame them, competition is tough... i surely wouldnt subject myself to them and I doubt I would subject a client to them. RoR: Why? because its Web 2.0( see CMP Media scandal ). The whole Web 2.0 thing( which RoR is invariably linked to ) has turned out to be a very stupid multi-level marketing scheme starring Tim O'Reilly. RoR offers no technological advantages over existing scripting languages, despite the magical claims of its proponents. > > I prefer Java, but learning new things broadens you > horizons and > understanding of development in general. I still like Perl. Larry Wall is the best. Id work for him. Python is also cool. thanks, jmz > > -----Original Message----- > From: josh zeidner [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Wednesday, June 21, 2006 10:15 AM > To: jug-discussion@tucson-jug.org > Subject: RE: [jug-discussion] App Dev Framework > choices > > > > --- Rick Hightower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Since I am a consulting, I give advice, but will > > happily work with Tapestry > > or JSF. > > > > Being a capitalist, I tend to pick the one with > the > > highest bill rate. :o) > > Being an engineer, I tend to pick the one with the > best value to my customer. :) > > It would appear that the app framework world is > going through the same gyrations that the mainframe > world did in the 80s. During this period we had > professional consultants who aimed to increase their > hourly wages by developing skills and reputation for > 'big game mainframes'. These high wages were kept > elevated by an ever increasing operative complexity, > which quickly degraded into an excess 'bloat' that, > at > best was a liability to the customer rather than an > advantage. During the late phases economic > relationships between the consultants( ala Byte > magazine and BITNET ) and the hardware providers( > IBM, > etc. ) had developed to block all but the most > esoteric and complex solutions to computing problems > from making it to market. The mainframes were > designed for the consultants, not the customers. > > The end of this phase is referred to as the 'PC > revolution'. The above situation resulted in a high > barrier to entry for digital business causing a high > demand for alternative solutions. This was coupled > with the proliferation of new electronics suppliers > in > Asia( specifically China ) due to changes in > military > and trade policy. Thus, what was once considered > the > domain of geeky hobbyists became the stage for a > phase > of new billionaires, with the likes of Steve Jobs > and > Bill Gates. > > To address the question directly, which one is > best? > There is an assumed aspect to this question... best > for whom? 1) the customer, 2) the developer. > Certainly value and success involve a comparitive > advantage for both parties. If history is to repeat > itself, and it always does... the mainframes that > did > survive were the ones whose life support was the > broadest and deepest, not necessarily the ones with > the nicest trim, buttons, and knobs, etc. Despite > this, the mainframe specialists as a species were > doomed to extinction, even the ones who worked on > the > last of dinosaurs. > > Strangely, the UNIX crowd is now sitting with the > cool kids again with the proliferation of Linux. > Most > of the new Linux hackers are kids, but you do find > the > occasional old senior amongst them offering up > advice > and cranky remarks about the Cold War and 'them damn > camyanists'. > > As far as survival strategies go aim for > standards, > not bling. -jmz > > > > > > > > > > > I am currently working with Scott Fau.....h and > > another ArcMinder in San > > Diego. > > > > We are working with JSF, Spring, Hibernate (and > soon > > iBatis). > > > > At night and sometimes at lunch, I work at a > project > > based in New York which > > is JSF based (mostly advice and guidance and > helping > > people out of sticky > > issues). In the early morning I've been working on > a > > Tapestry/Spring/Hibernate project. I've been > writing > > Tapestry custom > > components and helped them reconfigure the > > Spring/Hibernate bits (they had > > it configured a bit off). > > > > BTW, We are looking for people with > > JSF/Tapestry/Spring/Hibernate skills. > > > > I am tired and busy. > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Jon Thomas [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > Sent: Tuesday, June 20, 2006 12:16 PM > > To: jug-discussion@tucson-jug.org > > Subject: Re: [jug-discussion] App Dev Framework > > choices > > > > you may have just started the next religious war > > > > On Jun 20, 2006, at 11:30 AM, Thomas Hicks wrote: > > > > > Hey Rick, > > > > > > You raise an issue I've been looking at lately: > > the pros & cons > > > of various web app dev frameworks. I was > motivated > > by my lack > > > of knowledge about what's out there and inspired > > by Matt Raible's > > > comparison presentation > > (http://www.virtuas.com/articles/ > > > webframework-sweetspots.html). > > > > > > In the snippet below you mention JSF/Facelets > and > > Tapestry. > > > When do you choose to use Tapestry over > === message truncated === __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
