Bhushan Shah ha scritto: > Everyone, let's take a step back. > > Original discussion was, if project X can use gitlab issues instead of > bugzilla? If the developers/maintainers prefer? > > Potential arguments to which are either, > > - No they can't because we forbid it in our manifesto or code of conduct > or policies > - No they can't because it makes life of other developer harder > - No they can't because it makes life of other user harder > > As we stand neither of this arguments apply ... We have no written point > in KDE manifesto which allows community to force a developer tool of > their choice on new or existing project, as long as tool or service is > hosted within KDE infrastructure and doesn't cost sysadmins or community > resources/time maintaining that service. It is important have this > freedom, otherwise next day someone can come up with idea that all > projects should use cmake or autotools or qmake, because all of KDE > community should be using same buildsystem.
Sorry, but We did exactly this. We all switched to git for code. We all de-facto switched to CMake for Qt-based projects, whenever is possible. And there are good reasons for that. > > - Gitlab is hosted on KDE infrastructure and each KDE contributors can > access the service using their KDE identity account. > - Gitlab service is/will be actively maintained by KDE sysadmin team and > using it as bugzilla is not going to cost KDE e.V. any extra money. > > If developer/maintainer collectively thinks that using gitlab as bug > tracker makes their life easier instead of depending on bugzilla I don't > understand why other developers would have a problem with that? It's not > making their life difficult at all if they want to contribute, as > mentioned in earlier point Gitlab is accessible to all users and > developers. It is important for the rest of the community, as I mentioned earlier (see: consistency, and tooling). That's it. > As for users, let users decide? I mean we can't speak for all of our > userbase confidently that they love bugzilla and will stop reporting > bugs for other components if certain other project/application starts > using Gitlab for bugtracking, can either of you? Users don't decide where to report bugs: they follow the instructions (I can report countless of request of "where can I report this"). Having two places makes things confusing. > > On Wed, Jul 03, 2019 at 08:37:34PM +0200, Boudewijn Rempt wrote: >> Besides, it's already too easy to make a bug report. Getting more bug >> reports is not a priority for me; at this I would prefer to have less >> interaction between developers and users than more, because we're >> going crazy right now. > > This is your personal opinion. > >> And that's the important thing. Bugzilla is a developer tool, not a >> user tool. We must have easy tools to triage, query, sort, modify sets >> of reports. Bugzilla isn't perfect for that either, but the options >> gitlab gives for handling issues are so limited. > > If bugzilla is developer tool, gitlab is also developer tool, let > developer or maintainer decide how to best use it. > > On Thu, Jul 04, 2019 at 10:20:34AM +0200, Boudewijn Rempt wrote: >> On the other hand, we also need to use tools that make our work >> possible. Me being able to do my work, my developers being able to do >> their work is also important. These tools are not for marketing, they >> are for making the development process go better. And not just for >> newcomers, but also for the people actually shouldering the load of >> triaging ~150 reports a month. > > If Kaidan, Calindori or Plasma Mobile uses the Gitlab for issue reporting > because of either a) choice of maintainer or b) choice of specific > sub-community, that decision doesn't affect krita, okular or other KDE > applications. It does, as a global community. > >> I disagree. I'm fine with modernizing bugzilla to bugzilla 6. But >> gitlab's issues feature is not powerful enough to handle the amound of >> bug reports I have to handle. In other words, I cannot do my work with >> gitlab's issues feature. It might look more modern, but it just >> doesn't have the power. > > This is your personal opinion. Just like yours. > > On Thu, Jul 04, 2019 at 10:39:15AM +0200, Christoph Cullmann wrote: >> In our company we multiple times reviewed bug trackers (for migrating >> from Bugzilla), but none actually had a good enough feature set to be >> considered, beside perhaps Jira (which is non-free/open). >> >> I would wait for the Bugzilla 6 release to judge if the UI arrives in >> the 21th century before making any decisions what to use. Just that >> GitLab is more modern doesn't give it all the features one needs. > > This is your personal opinion. Do you mean that you don't want to evaluate the tools? Interesting. > > In general, I respect everyone's personal opinion that bugzilla at > moment superior to the gitlab issues, but at same time I also want to > respect other developers opinion/choices as long as they abide by the > KDE manifesto written and supported by our community. Let's go everyone's decide for themselves. Nice. -- Luigi
