Tim has absolutely nailed the point where I am having trouble. I would be making earnings and Valve gets no royalties. So yeah, it comes down to does Valve care?
About the few selective people, that is right, I don't expect many players to hit to play the campaign as with zombie mod or Portal 2, but I do hope I can get at least community spot light, I can only wish for that. The problem is that I cannot guarantee community spot light, but if the campaign does become good, I could negotiate about he possibilities. Again, I don't plan on being very expensive, just enough to motivate me to be better, and better, and better. On Wed, Sep 21, 2011 at 9:20 AM, Eugenio Roman <[email protected]>wrote: > Kevin, thanks for the messages. > > I cannot afford a lawyer, so if someone can tell me where to find the EULA > I will appreciate it. > > I can make an estimate of how many players can view the adds, my portal 2 > maps got over 6000 views each, so it can be promising. Now, I don't plan on > it being expensive, like say 40dls, for 1 add spot, 70 for 2 add spots, 90, > for 3 add spots, and 110 for 4 add spots. I have to count how many spaces I > have. I plan on adding a little village, so maybe I can add some panoramic > ads there too. > > I am not too concerned on the time of making the ads and neither for making > some legal document about what I am selling, an ad that about some thousand > people are going to view. I'll just have to be honest, and thus that is why > it is cheap. And price can always be negotiated with whoever is interested. > An uncle is a lawyer, so maybe I can get some legal advise, but I think I > need to to really read the EULA. I plan on contacting Valve for their > opinion too. > > ICS > Also, I am not following on the whole Cold Stream debate, is it relevant? > how? > > > On Wed, Sep 21, 2011 at 12:35 AM, ics <[email protected]> wrote: > >> This Cold Stream has bothered me since i saw it as i think it's first map >> is just like the "the inferno campaign" that the dude who said his got the >> best mappers on his site and they should make money or something. So long >> time, i can't even remember. >> >> But the map itself is very similiar except that it hasn't got the flames >> at the sky. All youtube videos have been deleted from it too. >> >> PS: Selling addspace, boo. >> >> -ics >> >> 21.9.2011 8:10, Kevin Mahoney kirjoitti: >> >> Hoo boy, I quite remember the last guy storming off the list in a huge >>> fit after all the feedback we gave. Guy was namedropping all over the place >>> boasting about how this idea was really going to take off. Haven't heard >>> anything since. ;) >>> >>> Since this is more of a client services issue, I'd suggest you hire a >>> lawyer before doing anything. Have him review the EULA, and if it's legal >>> have him draft the contract for each client service. What you need are >>> binding contracts that state exactly what the client is receiving in the >>> end. Not only will it cover your ass, but it'll also make the process a lot >>> easier by being honest with the client what exactly they're receiving. With >>> anything promising "potential revenue" you should not promise any definitive >>> gains, and you need to be clear about that. >>> >>> Honestly, I don't see this business model working. It's hard to sell as >>> a freelancer without any previous metrics for success. You'll probably only >>> get an investment from somebody who doesn't want to shell out a lot of cash >>> for what is likely a high-risk venture. Maybe you'll find a avid gamer >>> community website/company looking to promote itself and figures throwing a >>> small amount like $50-100 your way for a billboard ad in-game, but if they >>> have any sense of strategy they can see that $100 invested in an AdWords >>> campaign that will probably yield a much higher rate of impressions unless >>> your campaign becomes extremely popular. >>> >>> So, I'd advise against it. And since time itself is money, if I were in >>> your shoes I wouldn't invest the time into making something like that work >>> all by yourself. If you ran a marketing agency that had dumped resources >>> into R&D to get some hard metrics data to show financial viability in such >>> an investment, then I'd say have at it. But I think there are much easier >>> ways to make money to fund something like this. >>> >>> That said, there's always somebody that finds a niche who can make these >>> things work with some modest gains. But just keep in mind what everyone >>> else has said about the potential ethical dilemmas of it polluting/diluting >>> gameplay. >>> >>> If you just don't want to spend the time doing assets... just ask for >>> someone else to make the assets and promise them their name in the credits. >>> Most people don't have a problem going with that. >>> >>> —Kevin >>> >>> On Sep 20, 2011, at 8:17 PM, Eugenio Roman wrote: >>> >>> I hope, I mean, I am gonna do some visual test and post it here during >>>> the >>>> week, because I feel that it goes with the atmosphere. So, I thought >>>> selling >>>> some of those spots, might be a nice way to earn money and save some >>>> time >>>> doing some texture work, if someone proiveds me with an image they want >>>> to >>>> advertise. My main concern is the legality, like, what if they don't >>>> pay, >>>> they pay and I never finish the campaign, or someone suing me for >>>> copyright >>>> content on the advertiser's image, or valve simply frowning upon the >>>> idea of >>>> selling ad spots on a map. I'll try to do the test image tomorrow, if I >>>> am >>>> not overloaded with Uni work. >>>> >>>> On Tue, Sep 20, 2011 at 10:00 PM, Arthur Lin<[email protected]> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>> Somebody tried to recruit people to do this and he got plenty of good >>>>> feedback on why it is not a good idea. To me, the biggest problem (out >>>>> of >>>>> many) is that it cheapens the quality of the campaign and you don't >>>>> earn >>>>> that much for doing so. Valve has been experimenting with ways for >>>>> contributors to get something in return as you can see with TF2. For >>>>> L4D, >>>>> Cold Stream was a "commissioned" project if that's the correct >>>>> terminology. >>>>> What's funny is that the guy that tried to recruit people had some of >>>>> his >>>>> work incorporated into Cold Stream! I think he originally did the >>>>> scrolling >>>>> water effect in Freezer Burn and brought it over the horse-shoe map. >>>>> Anyway, >>>>> I'm sure the two have kind of arrangement involved. >>>>> >>>>> As for ads outright, I don't remember Valve really pushing them since >>>>> Counter-Strike. That may be a sign that they've learned a valuable >>>>> lesson >>>>> regarding that approach to at the very least keep it on hold. >>>>> >>>>> In any case, I'm sure you'll get something in return if people like >>>>> your >>>>> work, maybe worth more than just cash. >>>>> >>>>> On Tue, Sep 20, 2011 at 7:54 PM, Glen Huey<[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> This came up once before with someone on here and received a pretty >>>>>> cold >>>>>> response. I don't know for certain but I believe the only way to >>>>>> profit >>>>>> from this hobby is to build an impressive enough portfolio of work >>>>>> that a >>>>>> gaming company hires you. >>>>>> On Sep 20, 2011 7:14 PM, "Eugenio Roman"<eugenio.motanum91@** >>>>>> gmail.com <[email protected]>> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> Hello, so recently I got an idea to earn some money with the time I >>>>>>> am >>>>>>> spending on my L4D2 campaign. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> In my campaign, the survivors get to some subway stations, and I was >>>>>>> thinking of puting some add spots and sell them to, I donno, whoever >>>>>>> >>>>>> wants >>>>>> >>>>>>> to purchase that spot. A bit like how Deus Ex has real adds on its >>>>>>> >>>>>> game, >>>>> >>>>>> exept, mine won't be dinamic, it will be a one time add forever. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The only problem I see, is the legality of doing this. Can I sell >>>>>>> spots >>>>>>> >>>>>> in >>>>>> >>>>>>> my map? I am not selling the maps, but just adds on the map. The map >>>>>>> is >>>>>>> >>>>>> free >>>>>> >>>>>>> and people would pay me to get their image on some places of the >>>>>>> >>>>>> campaign. >>>>>> I >>>>>> >>>>>>> sent Gabe an email some hours ago, but I doubt he will reply. I also >>>>>>> >>>>>> can't >>>>>> >>>>>>> seem to find the Left 4 Dead 2 Authoring tools' EULA so I can fully >>>>>>> >>>>>> read >>>>> >>>>>> it. >>>>>> >>>>>>> So, I am hoping someone over at Valve (Chet!) can lend me some advise >>>>>>> >>>>>> on >>>>> >>>>>> this. It would be nice to get something out of all this time I am >>>>>>> >>>>>> investing. >>>>>> >>>>>>> What do you guys think? Should I go for it? Any unforseeable >>>>>>> >>>>>> consequences? >>>>>> >>>>>>> Any of you tried this before? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Thanks >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> Eugenio "Motanum" Roman >>>>>>> >>>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>>> http://twitter.com/#!/MotanumR >>>>>>> http://steamcommunity.com/id/**Motanum<http://steamcommunity.com/id/Motanum> >>>>>>> http://www.youtube.com/user/**motanium<http://www.youtube.com/user/motanium> >>>>>>> ______________________________**_________________ >>>>>>> L4Dmapper mailing list >>>>>>> [email protected].**com<[email protected]> >>>>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/**cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/**l4dmapper<http://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/l4dmapper> >>>>>>> >>>>>> ______________________________**_________________ >>>>>> L4Dmapper mailing list >>>>>> [email protected].**com <[email protected]> >>>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/**cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/**l4dmapper<http://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/l4dmapper> >>>>>> >>>>>> ______________________________**_________________ >>>>> L4Dmapper mailing list >>>>> [email protected].**com <[email protected]> >>>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/**cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/**l4dmapper<http://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/l4dmapper> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> Eugenio "Motanum" Roman >>>> >>>> [email protected] >>>> http://twitter.com/#!/MotanumR >>>> http://steamcommunity.com/id/**Motanum<http://steamcommunity.com/id/Motanum> >>>> http://www.youtube.com/user/**motanium<http://www.youtube.com/user/motanium> >>>> ______________________________**_________________ >>>> L4Dmapper mailing list >>>> [email protected].**com <[email protected]> >>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/**cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/**l4dmapper<http://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/l4dmapper> >>>> >>> >>> ______________________________**_________________ >>> L4Dmapper mailing list >>> [email protected].**com <[email protected]> >>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/**cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/**l4dmapper<http://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/l4dmapper> >>> >> >> >> ______________________________**_________________ >> L4Dmapper mailing list >> [email protected].**com <[email protected]> >> http://list.valvesoftware.com/**cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/**l4dmapper<http://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/l4dmapper> >> > > > > -- > Eugenio "Motanum" Roman > > [email protected] > http://twitter.com/#!/MotanumR > http://steamcommunity.com/id/Motanum > http://www.youtube.com/user/motanium > > > -- Eugenio "Motanum" Roman [email protected] http://twitter.com/#!/MotanumR http://steamcommunity.com/id/Motanum http://www.youtube.com/user/motanium _______________________________________________ L4Dmapper mailing list [email protected] http://list.valvesoftware.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/l4dmapper
