I would add, as a complete non-expert, that in terms of socioeconomics, it
is fairly likely that most potential contributors to Northern Luri
Wikipedia would be near the population (and commercial/education) centers,
and therefore likely to use (or at least be quite comfortable with and
accepting of) the Khorramabadi (central) dialect, even if it is "less pure"
or "less Luri" by some definition.
Mjbmr: I think you've shared valuable information here, but you do need to
exercise more patience with the process. LangCom deals with complex
decisions that are relatively high-stakes, in the sense that once things
are set in motion they are quite difficult and perhaps impossible to
undo/reverse. So deliberation and patience are the natural modes for it.
A.
On Wed, May 6, 2015 at 5:10 PM, Mjbmr <[email protected]> wrote:
> You can simply ignore comments you don't like instead of showing nice of
> you.
>
>
> On 5/6/2015 10:00 PM, Gerard Meijssen wrote:
>
> Hoi,
> Non-members may be asked to shut up. Members vote, their opinion counts.
> Thanks,
> GerardM
>
> On 6 May 2015 at 18:56, Mjbmr <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>> I have rights to speak and give my opinion whether you like it not.
>> You're not locals, I'm sharing my knowledge.
>>
>> On 5/6/2015 8:32 PM, MF-Warburg wrote:
>> > I would appreciate it if non-members could be reserved in throwing
>> around their own expertise and dismissing linguists' opinions, if they are
>> not themselves experts in this field.
>>
>> On 5/6/2015 9:12 PM, Gerard Meijssen wrote:
>>
>> Hoi,
>> Please do not be unnecessarily negative.. Preferences are just that.
>> Thanks,
>> Gere
>>
>> On 6 May 2015 at 17:49, Mjbmr <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>>> If Anonby thinks that it's a shame Lurish must use more old Lurish
>>> verbs that new driven from Persian verbs, then we should start speaking in
>>> Old English. btw Mohammad Mogoei (Mogoeilor) is native Northeren Luri from
>>> capital of Lurestan province and he knows all dialects of Luri language
>>> including Southern and Bakhtiari.
>>>
>>>
>>> On 5/6/2015 8:00 PM, MF-Warburg wrote:
>>>
>>> I. We still haven't formally said yet that Northern Luri is an
>>> eligible language, but it seems like there is no issue with it.
>>> II. Activity: Most-used msgs are complete [1] & contributions on
>>> Incubator are steady since >12 months (thousands of small edits always by
>>> Mogoeilor, who should use preview more often, but also contributions from
>>> other users), though so far in this month only 2 users over the
>>> 10-edit-threshold [2].
>>> III. About Erik Anonby's response, I wonder how "welcoming" the
>>> peculiarities noted by him would be to other speakers of the language who
>>> do not use this particular dialect. Should we maybe ask him or Mehdi
>>> Moshkriz for their opinion on that?
>>>
>>>
>>> [1] <https://tools.wmflabs.org/robin/?tool=codelookup&code=lrc>
>>> [2] <
>>> https://tools.wmflabs.org/meta/catanalysis/index.php?cat=0&title=Wp/lrc&wiki=incubatorwiki#distribution_201505
>>> >
>>>
>>> 2015-04-28 10:44 GMT+02:00 Oliver Stegen <[email protected]>:
>>>
>>>> Have we passed step #1 yet? i.e. has Northern Luri fulfilled the
>>>> requirements for leaving the incubator?
>>>> If yes, is the aforementioned Erik Anonby an acceptable reference? I've
>>>> actually met him several years ago at a linguistics conference, so if we
>>>> all agree that we've concluded step #1, I'd be happy to contact him to see
>>>> whether he himself could verify Northern Luri or whether he could recommend
>>>> someone else to do so for us.
>>>>
>>>> Fwiw,
>>>> Oliver
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 28-Apr-15 1:15 AM, Asaf Bartov wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Thanks, that sounds perfectly reasonable. Is there an owner to the
>>>> process, e.g. a committee secretary, to ensure that in case of silence
>>>> after asking #2, there is actual progress toward #3, so that it doesn't
>>>> fall between the cracks?
>>>>
>>>> A.
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Apr 27, 2015 at 2:38 PM, MF-Warburg <[email protected]>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> We obviously discuss
>>>>> 1. whether at this stage we need to verify the content at all
>>>>> 2. if yes, whether someone knows an expert already
>>>>> 3. if no, whom to contact.
>>>>> Then we contact people.
>>>>>
>>>>> 2015-04-27 22:51 GMT+02:00 Asaf Bartov <[email protected]>:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm not clear on the committee's process: Is it the expectation of
>>>>>> this committee that nothing will happen until Someone<tm> produces expert
>>>>>> testimony confirming that the content currently in the Northern Luri
>>>>>> Wikipedia is in fact Northern Luri? Or is the committee taking any steps
>>>>>> to secure such testimony?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, Apr 27, 2015 at 1:34 PM, Gerard Meijssen <
>>>>>> [email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hoi,
>>>>>>> Reading an article does not make us an expert.
>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>> GerardM
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 27 April 2015 at 15:17, Mjbmr <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Here's the article I found titled "Update on Luri: How many
>>>>>>>> languages?" by Erik John Anonby: original link
>>>>>>>> <http://anonby.balafon.net/wp-content/uploads/2007/06/jra-172-171-197.pdf>,
>>>>>>>> you can see on the figure #2, said "Luri-Lurestani-khorramabadi" is the
>>>>>>>> main dialect and "Luri-Borujerdi" is the other dialect of Northern Luri
>>>>>>>> (lrc), and on the figure #3 shown west of current Iran's map, said
>>>>>>>> "Lurestani" is the main area of Northern Luri (lrc), lower on these
>>>>>>>> dialects is "Laki" on the figure #2 sands for Laki language (lki) , and
>>>>>>>> "Laki" area on the figure #3. On the figure #2 upper of Northern Luri
>>>>>>>> (lrc)
>>>>>>>> dialects you can see the "Bakhtiari" (bqi) dialects and "Kohkiloyeh"
>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>> "Bouyerahmad" (Southern Luri [luz]) as well. On pages #186 to #197 you
>>>>>>>> can
>>>>>>>> compares the example differences between these languages.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 4/27/2015 2:14 PM, Oliver Stegen wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> As I mentioned also concerning Western Balochi, we need an outside
>>>>>>>> scholar / linguist / language expert for verification purposes. Any
>>>>>>>> useful
>>>>>>>> bona-fide contacts?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 25-Apr-15 6:41 PM, Mjbmr wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> This
>>>>>>>> <https://incubator.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wp/lrc/%D9%86%D9%88%D9%85%DA%AF%D9%87_%DA%AF%D9%88%D8%AA%D8%A7%D8%B1%DB%8C%D8%A7_%D9%86%D8%A7%D8%B2%D8%A7%D8%B1>
>>>>>>>> is the list of top articles was provided by Mogoeilor, even he named
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> language of this wikipedia, Northern Luri on their main page, and I
>>>>>>>> didn't
>>>>>>>> see that.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 4/25/2015 11:27 AM, Mjbmr wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Yes.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 4/25/2015 11:22 AM, Gerard Meijssen wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hoi,
>>>>>>>> A longstanding requirement for any and all languages is that they
>>>>>>>> have to have an ISO-639-3 code and, that they are a language not a
>>>>>>>> macro
>>>>>>>> language.
>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>> GerardM
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 25 April 2015 at 08:16, Mjbmr <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> There is no such thing as they are a resources of world's
>>>>>>>>> languages, people are the resources and they only maintainer code, the
>>>>>>>>> unified codes that the world uses. Is there any confirmation of Luri
>>>>>>>>> Wikipedia yet?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 4/25/2015 10:31 AM, Gerard Meijssen wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hoi,
>>>>>>>>> Ethnologue is the maintainer of the ISO-639-3. As such they are an
>>>>>>>>> authority.
>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>> GerardM
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 25 April 2015 at 06:34, Mjbmr <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> You're right, I can't trust a self verification too, but what do
>>>>>>>>>> you expect me do to?, you can probably find a lot of trustable
>>>>>>>>>> resources on
>>>>>>>>>> the Internet, I my self can't even trust ethnologue, because I found
>>>>>>>>>> unuseful information on it and I don't know where they come from, at
>>>>>>>>>> least
>>>>>>>>>> in Wikipedia, we have resources, I didn't expect that from you.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On 4/25/2015 8:46 AM, Gerard Meijssen wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Hoi,
>>>>>>>>>> Wikipedia is in this not an authority. It has never been. Again,
>>>>>>>>>> self certification does not work for me.. We have been hurt by that
>>>>>>>>>> before.
>>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>>> GerardM
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On 25 April 2015 at 00:03, Mjbmr <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Alright then, that's Northern Luri, fair enough, I didn't have
>>>>>>>>>>> any knowledge that there is a southern dialect of it and people of
>>>>>>>>>>> Kohgiluyeh and Boyerahmadi, and Yasuj speak that, I only knew
>>>>>>>>>>> Lorestan, but
>>>>>>>>>>> per English wikipedia, they're dialects of Northern Luri which this
>>>>>>>>>>> wiki is
>>>>>>>>>>> written in.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On 4/25/2015 2:12 AM, Gerard Meijssen wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Hoi,
>>>>>>>>>>> Check this out ... http://www.ethnologue.com/subgroups/luri-0
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> It rather complicates things... By the way self certification
>>>>>>>>>>> is not a good idea.
>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>>>> GerardM
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On 24 April 2015 at 22:45, Mjbmr <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Yes. 100%, as I live Iran and I know some parts of this
>>>>>>>>>>>> language, it is definitely Luri. Mohammad Mogoei (User:Mogoeilor)
>>>>>>>>>>>> the most
>>>>>>>>>>>> active user of this project is from Lorestan so definitely he
>>>>>>>>>>>> speaks in
>>>>>>>>>>>> this language every day. In Iran it's called Luri, some people
>>>>>>>>>>>> call it
>>>>>>>>>>>> Lurish
>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Requests_for_new_languages/Wikipedia_Lurish>
>>>>>>>>>>>> as the translation for English, per this
>>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www-01.sil.org/iso639-3/documentation.asp?id=lrc> the
>>>>>>>>>>>> language should be called Northern Luri, but none of it dialects
>>>>>>>>>>>> are called
>>>>>>>>>>>> Luri, so I call it Luri too. I have also submitted and now
>>>>>>>>>>>> accepted a
>>>>>>>>>>>> ticket to CLDR to support this language. Other proposal of
>>>>>>>>>>>> dialects of this
>>>>>>>>>>>> language like Bakhtiari
>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Requests_for_new_languages/Wikipedia_Bakhtiari>
>>>>>>>>>>>> failed because of being a part of this language. Also they list of
>>>>>>>>>>>> article
>>>>>>>>>>>> I've just provided are the best of them as you can see there are
>>>>>>>>>>>> no Persian
>>>>>>>>>>>> words in them.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On 4/25/2015 12:37 AM, Gerard Meijssen wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Hoi,
>>>>>>>>>>>> Do we have confirmation that it is indeed Luri ?
>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>>>>>>>> Gerard
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On 24 April 2015 at 20:42, Mjbmr <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I ask langcom members for approval of Luri Wikipedia,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> here are some top articles I could list, but there are more of
>>>>>>>>>>>>> them
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1. استیو جابز
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http:///wiki/Wp/lrc/%D8%A7%D8%B3%D8%AA%DB%8C%D9%88_%D8%AC%D8%A7%D8%A8%D8%B2>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> (Steve Jobs)
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2. آلورت انیشتین
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http:///wiki/Wp/lrc/%D8%A2%D9%84%D9%88%D8%B1%D8%AA_%D8%A7%D9%86%DB%8C%D8%B4%D8%AA%DB%8C%D9%86>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> (Albert Einstein)
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 3. کلمبیا
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http:///wiki/Wp/lrc/%DA%A9%D9%84%D9%85%D8%A8%DB%8C%D8%A7>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> (Colombia)
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 4. شهید چمران
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http:///wiki/Wp/lrc/%D8%B4%D9%87%DB%8C%D8%AF_%DA%86%D9%85%D8%B1%D8%A7%D9%86>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> (Mostafa Chamran)
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 5. شایا عیلامی
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http:///wiki/Wp/lrc/%D8%B4%D8%A7%DB%8C%D8%A7_%D8%B9%DB%8C%D9%84%D8%A7%D9%85%DB%8C>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> (List of rulers of Elam)
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 6. کارلوس فوئنتس
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http:///wiki/Wp/lrc/%DA%A9%D8%A7%D8%B1%D9%84%D9%88%D8%B3_%D9%81%D9%88%D8%A6%D9%86%D8%AA%D8%B3>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> (Carlos Fuentes)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Analysis
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://tools.wmflabs.org/meta/catanalysis/index.php?cat=0&title=Wp/lrc&wiki=incubatorwiki#list_editors>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> shows that this project has enough users and most of
>>>>>>>>>>>>> mediawiki message
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <https://tools.wmflabs.org/robin/?tool=codelookup&code=lrc>has
>>>>>>>>>>>>> been translated.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Langcom mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]
>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/langcom
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>> Langcom mailing
>>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/langcom
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>> Langcom mailing list
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>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>> Langcom mailing
>>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/langcom
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> Langcom mailing
>>>>>>>>>> [email protected]https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/langcom
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Langcom mailing
>>>>>>>> [email protected]https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/langcom
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Asaf Bartov
>>>>>> Wikimedia Foundation <http://www.wikimediafoundation.org>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Imagine a world in which every single human being can freely share
>>>>>> in the sum of all knowledge. Help us make it a reality!
>>>>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Langcom mailing list
>>>>> [email protected]
>>>>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/langcom
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> Asaf Bartov
>>>> Wikimedia Foundation <http://www.wikimediafoundation.org>
>>>>
>>>> Imagine a world in which every single human being can freely share
>>>> in the sum of all knowledge. Help us make it a reality!
>>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org
>>>>
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>>>>
>>>
>>>
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>
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