Dear Roland,
probably you missed the mail of Stephan Olbertz, who posted to the lute
list only:
"Think of the galant lute trio like a piano trio... You get the idea"
That really is the point:
In that times lute trio meant lute, violin (or flute) and basso, very
often in a way, that the two added instruments play the melody and the
bass of the lute part, but in later times
- and that for sure is the case with Kropfgans - with different voices
for violin and lute, and also the bass often plays a extended line
(sometimes even another voice: Philipp Martin(o), Daube etc.)
I don't think we have testimonies of a trio of 3 lutes at that time,
though such music probably existed (e.g. v. Radolt used 3 differently
tuned lutes in one of his ensemble works)!
The works of Kropfgans are mentioned in Gerber 1st edition 1792, vol. 1,
759f:
Kropfgans (Johann) geb. 14.10.1708 - nach 1769:
"Von seinen Kompositionen sind nur 3 Lautensolos zu Nürnberg gestochen
worden. In Mspt. hingegen hat man von ihm 36 Solos, 6 Duos für 2 Lauten,
32 Trios für Laute, Violin und Violonzell, 1 Quartett für Laute, Fr.
Viol. und Violonz. Auch hat er einige Hillerische Operetten auf die
Laute gesetzt."
i.e.
- 3 Solos had been published in Nürnberg by Haffner
In manuscript we have:
- 36 Solos
- 6 Duos
- 32 Trios for lute, violin and cello
- 1 Quartett for lute, flute, violine and cello
- Operetts by Hiller set to the lute
Best regards
Markus
Am 16.05.2018 um 03:03 schrieb Roland Hayes:
Apologies. I meant trio for lute violin and cello. r
------------------------------------------------------------------------
*From:* lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu <lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu> on behalf
of Markus Lutz <mar...@gmlutz.de>
*Sent:* Tuesday, May 15, 2018 7:11:22 PM
*To:* lute@cs.dartmouth.edu; Roland Hayes
*Subject:* [LUTE] Re: Johann Kropfgans
In one of the lexika of the end of the 18th or beginning of the 19th
century there is a remark, that Johann Kropfgans wrote 32 lute trios,
but I cannot say at the moment, in which one it is written.
We only have some complete trios in Brusseles and in Berlin.
In Brusseles there probably are some even written by himself.
Best regards
Markus
Am 15.05.2018 um 23:43 schrieb Arthur Ness:
Hi Stephen,
You got it ! ! !
----------------------------------------------------
12 Trios lute, violin âcello in B-Br Ms II 4088. Also the Pichler
piece in Ms II 4087 (viii) according to Tim Crawford.
Meyer, Christian. "Les Manuscrits De Luth Du Fonds Fétis (Bruxelles,
Bibliothèque Royale Albert Ier, Mss II 4086-4089)." Revue Belge De
Musicologie / Belgisch Tijdschrift Voor Muziekwetenschap, vol. 50,
1996, pp. 197â216. JSTOR, JSTOR, [1]www.jstor.org/stable/3687046.
Also listed with complete titles in Boetticher's RISM VII inventory,
pp. 62-4. These were from the Fétis collection and may have been
acquired from the Breitkopf auction of 1832 (can't find my notes). The
catalogue is extremely rare, but is about 1 ½ inches thick.***
Breitkopf decided to empty their warehouse of outmoded music. What a
treasure!! Unique copies of some of the Bach lute pieces were among
the offering.
Stephan Olbertz, "An Unknown Lute Piece in a Keyboard Manuscript with
Works by Wilhelm Friedemann Bach," JLSA 44 (2012): 1-22.
***Copy in the University Library, Amsterdam (NO Longer in the
Amsterdam public library).
Enjoy, Roland!
Arthur Ness
arthurjn...@verizon.net
-----Original Message-----
From: Stephan Olbertz <stephan.olbe...@web.de>
To: 'Lute Net' <lute@cs.dartmouth.edu>
Sent: Tue, May 15, 2018 4:24 pm
Subject: [LUTE] Re: Johann Kropfgans
Think of the galant lute trio like a piano trio... You get the idea ;-)
Best
Stephan
-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: lute-[2]a...@cs.dartmouth.edu [[3]mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu]
Im Auftrag von Stewart McCoy
Gesendet: Dienstag, 15. Mai 2018 21:05
An: Lute Net
Betreff: [LUTE] Johann Kropfgans
Dear Roland,
Iââ¬â¢m afraid I donââ¬â¢t know about these trios by Johann
Kropfgans, but I
would very much like to know more about them. I see from a quick search
on the internet that Kropfgans wrote chamber music for the lute, violin
and cello, including one in C minor, but I see no evidence of lute
trios. It is possible that Lutz Kirchhof made his own lute trio
arrangements from those chamber music pieces, but Iââ¬â¢m only
guessing.
Hopefully youââ¬â¢ll be able to find out more.
Best wishes,
Stewart.
From: [1]Roland Hayes
Sent: Tuesday, May 15, 2018 7:10 PM
To: [2]Wayne ; [3]Stewart McCoy
Cc: [4]lute net
Subject: Johann Kropfgans
He wrote 32 lute trios? What are the sources? I just heard one in c
minor w/ Lutz Kerchoff. Outstanding!! r
--
References
1. [4]mailto:rha...@legalaidbuffalo.org
2. [5]mailto:wst...@cs.dartmouth.edu
3. [6]mailto:lu...@tiscali.co.uk
4. [7]mailto:lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
To get on or off this list see list information at
[8]http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
--
References
1. http://www.jstor.org/stable/3687046
2. mailto:a...@cs.dartmouth.edu
3. mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu?
4. mailto:rha...@legalaidbuffalo.org?
5. mailto:wst...@cs.dartmouth.edu?
6. mailto:lu...@tiscali.co.uk?
7. mailto:lute@cs.dartmouth.edu?
8. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
--
Markus Lutz
Schulstraße 11
88422 Bad Buchau
Tel 0 75 82 / 92 62 89
Fax 0 75 82 / 92 62 90
Mail mar...@gmlutz.de
This message is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to
which it is addressed, and may contain information that is privileged,
confidential and exempt from disclosure under applicable law. If the
reader of this message is not the intended recipient, or the employee or
agent responsible for delivering the message to the intended recipient,
you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, or copying
of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this
communication in error, please notify us immediately by telephone and
return the original message to us at i...@legalaidbuffalo.org
--
Markus Lutz
Schulstraße 11
88422 Bad Buchau
Tel 0 75 82 / 92 62 89
Fax 0 75 82 / 92 62 90
Mail mar...@gmlutz.de
