A journey of the dark night, or trip into the inferno is one way through the dross into possibility. Sure, it is a part of life and most of us experience it at some point. Yet, I think, at some point farther along the road, we can let go of our need of it. Do we need the pain to contemplate the beauty? Is the movement between polarities all there is? I know that at some point, our need for opposition falls away and we are able to move without it. But we don't get there clinging to what we don't like or what we are not or what we find reprehensible. All of this does have a place, yes, but it is mechanistic and rooted in the reactive. Moving beyond it does not call for denial or rose colored glasses. It does require a maturity of ego (and soul) and a letting go of our fascination with horror and drama (usually based on that victim, hero, villain scenario that gives us the scene unfolding between polarities.)
On Mar 21, 9:14 pm, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > I'd rather hope you'd think it pretty obvious I spend a lot of time > encouraging Molly. And that part of that involves needing to imagine > a lot of deficiencies and how they arise. There is the question of > denial and I'm sure one needs imagination to find out how to invite > the 'right' material in. I do think Derrida got something very > positive out of a recognition of what you are saying (and often say). > One 'report' after another in the UK is showing that responsibility > has taken flight out of the window, much as in Priestley's 'An > Inspector Calls'. I doubt any set of finite fetish has anything > infinite. The imagination has to probe beyond fetish, perhaps even to > the extent of descent into the inferno in order to find the better > life (a story often told and misunderstood). We may want intelligence > and beauty to succeed as perhaps matter has succeeded against anti- > matter, but in this sense I believe that origins are complex and that > we act between polarities. I don't believe imagination is wasted in > seeking to understand a continuum and how we may balance positions in > that. When I find people simply lying about what is positive against > all the evidence I am not inclined to dismiss that. > > On 21 Mar, 17:49, Molly Brogan <[email protected]> wrote: > > > Seems to me a waste of imagination to imagine "human being may lack > > the capacity to see > > human beings as human beings." But certainly, if you do, that is what > > you will get. > > > Imagining that human beings are capable of intelligence and beauty > > might get us further. > > > At some point, while immersed in the finite and infinite, we have to > > imagine the life we desire for ourselves. If we spend our time > > realising ignorance, trash chimping censorship or politesse, or even > > dwelling in that reality that screams these aspects at us, we should > > ask ourselves, why am I here? Do I enjoy feeling the victim of it > > all? Do I feel alive when I can say - that is rotten, I am not that. > > More alive than when I say, "I can see that these folks have more in > > them, the possibility of moving into something more intelligent and > > beautiful. And, I can see myself surrounded by intelligent, beautiful > > aspects of life. Sometimes, we deny that intelligence and beauty are > > a part of our life because it pains us to feel the lack of it. And > > that pain makes us feel alive, so we cling to it. But beauty and > > intelligence is all around us, just as the rest of the spectrum of > > life is there. Recognizing our choice and responsibility are the > > first steps to inviting in that possibility into our own lives. When > > we invite in possibility, we create our opportunity to move from the > > finite to the infinite. From the limited to the unlimited. I do > > agree, Neil, that imagination is key. > > > On Mar 21, 6:26 am, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > Chimpout says it all Don. I reckon the bald guy in front of the bench > > > sat with a black woman is trying out his arm on her. We are so > > > secretive I can't imagine a set of councillors letting cameras in for > > > fear of us finding out what they do. > > > > It's struck me since I can remember thinking much that infinity is > > > connected with imagination and we have trouble keeping the imagination > > > alive in discussions. > > > > "If it makes sense to speak of human beings as human beings, then it > > > makes sense to imagine that a human being may lack the capacity to see > > > human beings as human beings. It would make sense to ask whether > > > someone may be soul-blind." - this from Stanley Cavell (somewhere). I > > > can just about remember being taught stuff like Johari's Window and > > > receiving it rather badly because I thought people just did > > > reflection, before realising there was a whole lot more ignorance > > > about than a little grammar school boy knew - an infinity of it on > > > might say. We often sweep away stuff under the carpet of not being > > > bothered to have to put up with trash chimping as in Don's U-Tube > > > find, but this leads to censorship through politesse as we treat > > > people with critical views that need to be heard to the general in- > > > group, soul-less chimping humans do to try and avoid embarrassment. > > > > On 21 Mar, 04:18, Don Johnson <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > Could be worse. I used to be amused at the antics of British > > > > parliament. What with all the muttering and such. I shouldn't have > > > > been so smug. Here's a link to a real, live American city council > > > > meeting. How utterly embarrassing. > > > > >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qqOSNI7l0bQ > > > > > Our tax dollars at work. How do these people ever stay elected? I > > > > just don't get it. > > > > > dj > > > > > On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 7:37 PM, archytas <[email protected]> > > > > wrote: > > > > > > Sue and I can rarely bear the language of most of what intrudes into > > > > > our lives - it seems like irritating distraction that is aimed at > > > > > preventing us communicating. I went to an anticrime meeting on > > > > > Thursday that was a total disaster in this respect. The outright > > > > > lying and presence of a claque as the police and council people who > > > > > are failing us so badly made themselves out to be doing a good job. > > > > > There was no capacity for personal review. I had to leave. > > > > > > On 20 Mar, 20:06, ornamentalmind <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > >> Lovely and inscrutable post ...as always Neil! :-) > > > > > >> I’m not so sure it is lack of interest as much as lack of visible > > > > >> availability. Perhaps the charlatans don’t help much either. > > > > > >> As to being able to ‘check’….as is the case for all scientific > > > > >> exploration, a personal review I find to be the best…how else would I > > > > >> actually know? …faith?... on some of those wondrous published papers > > > > >> we talk about often here? > > > > > >> The truth is that much is currently made explicit….again, mostly lack > > > > >> of distribution and acceptance in this current rather barbaric and > > > > >> confused culture. > > > > > >> On Mar 20, 10:43 am, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > >> > There are phenomenological practices about Orn - I guess part of > > > > >> > the > > > > >> > lack of interest is to do with people lying about what they find > > > > >> > and > > > > >> > there being no way to check. I sense that much that we do is done > > > > >> > in > > > > >> > pretence of secrecy and we'd be better off with a narrative of > > > > >> > what we > > > > >> > are looking at made explicit. > > > > > >> > On 18 Mar, 15:01, ornamentalmind <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > >> > > Neil, thanks for the recent, albeit rather barbaric study. I > > > > >> > > have been > > > > >> > > sharing this type of information all along. For those who missed > > > > >> > > my > > > > >> > > post with the link to the Santa Barbara Institute, take some > > > > >> > > time and > > > > >> > > read, watch, listen to as many of the internal links there as > > > > >> > > you can. > > > > >> > > The place is run by an old friend of mine, Alan Wallace. He > > > > >> > > taught me > > > > >> > > Tibetan in the mid 80s and I've done 7 day long intensive > > > > >> > > shamatha > > > > >> > > retreat with him.http://www.sbinstitute.com/ > > > > > >> > > All the way back to William James the scientific study of mind/ > > > > >> > > consciousness has been addressed in western psych. > > > > >> > > Unfortunately, few > > > > >> > > in the west after James followed his recommendation to not only > > > > >> > > study > > > > >> > > behavior and the somatic body, but introspection...mind looking > > > > >> > > at > > > > >> > > mind itself. > > > > > >> > > On Mar 18, 5:41 am, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > >> > > > Electrodes implanted in the brains of people with epilepsy > > > > >> > > > might have > > > > >> > > > resolved an ancient question about consciousness. Signals from > > > > >> > > > the > > > > >> > > > electrodes seem to show that consciousness arises from the > > > > >> > > > coordinated > > > > >> > > > activity of the entire brain. The signals also take us closer > > > > >> > > > to > > > > >> > > > finding an objective "consciousness signature" that could be > > > > >> > > > used to > > > > >> > > > probe the process in animals and people with brain damage > > > > >> > > > without > > > > >> > > > inserting electrodes. Previously it wasn't clear whether a > > > > >> > > > dedicated > > > > >> > > > brain area, or "seat of consciousness", was responsible for > > > > >> > > > guiding > > > > >> > > > our subjective view of the world, or whether consciousness was > > > > >> > > > the > > > > >> > > > result of concerted activity across the whole brain (the > > > > >> > > > pineal gland > > > > >> > > > was an old favourite). Probing the process has been a > > > > >> > > > challenge, as > > > > >> > > > non-invasive techniques such as magnetic resonance imaging and > > > > >> > > > EEG > > > > >> > > > give either spatial or temporal information but not both. The > > > > >> > > > best way > > > > >> > > > to get both simultaneously is to implant electrodes deep > > > > >> > > > inside the > > > > >> > > > skull, but it is difficult to justify this in healthy people > > > > >> > > > for > > > > >> > > > ethical reasons (volunteers being those who fail to take two > > > > >> > > > steps > > > > >> > > > backwards). > > > > > >> > > > Between the 10 volunteers, the researchers received > > > > >> > > > information from a > > > > >> > > > total of 176 electrodes, which covered almost the whole brain. > > > > >> > > > During > > > > >> > > > the first 300 milliseconds of the experiment, brain activity > > > > >> > > > during > > > > >> > > > both the non-conscious and conscious tasks was very similar, > > > > >> > > > indicating that the process of consciousness had not kicked > > > > >> > > > in. But > > > > >> > > > after that, there were several types of brain activity that > > > > >> > > > only > > > > >> > > > occurred in the individuals who were aware of the words that > > > > >> > > > were > > > > >> > > > specially delivered in the experiments. > > > > > >> > > > First, there was an increase in the voltage levels of the > > > > >> > > > signals in > > > > >> > > > their brains. Second, the frequency and phase of neurons > > > > >> > > > firing in > > > > >> > > > different parts of the brain seemed to synchronise. Then some > > > > >> > > > of these > > > > >> > > > synchronised signals appeared to be triggering others. For > > > > >> > > > example, > > > > >> > > > activity in the occipital lobe seemed to cause activity in the > > > > >> > > > frontal > > > > >> > > > lobe. Because this activity only occurred in volunteers when > > > > >> > > > they > > > > >> > > > were aware of the words, the research team argue that it > > > > >> > > > constitutes a > > > > >> > > > consciousness signature. As much of this activity was spread > > > > >> > > > across > > > > >> > > > the brain, they say that consciousness has no single "seat". > > > > >> > > > "Consciousness is more a question of dynamics, than of a local > > > > >> > > > activity," is the conclusion. > > > > >> > > > Journal reference: PLoS Biology, DOI: > > > > >> > > > 10.1371/journal.pbio.1000061 > > > > > >> > > > I suspect this may not tell us much more than something about > > > > >> > > > the > > > > >> > > > speeds at which consciousness operates, but I do sense we are > > > > >> > > > approaching understanding at empirical levels that could > > > > >> > > > inspire an > > > > >> > > > Einstein to come up with something we could manipulate > > > > >> > > > conceptually in > > > > >> > > > terms of a theory in touch with empirical testing. I do > > > > >> > > > wonder how > > > > >> > > > far we might be from being able to wire up distantly separated > > > > >> > > > Ornamental monks chanting for peace etc. Sadly the only > > > > >> > > > experiments I > > > > >> > > > can afford to do have to be basic and cheap. Getting Molly > > > > >> > > > and Gabby > > > > >> > > > to hold hands without destroying the universe might be > > > > >> > > > financially > > > > >> > > > feasible, if impossible in reality and people seem to give a > > > > >> > > > damn > > > > >> > > > whether the universe continues for them or > > > ... > > > read more » --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. 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