(...ant...)
On Aug 29, 11:49 am, ornamentalmind <[email protected]> wrote:
> ...perhaps you meant 'how repugnent'?.... :-)
>
> On Aug 29, 11:47 am, Molly Brogan <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>
> > how cynical!
>
> > On Aug 29, 2:39 pm, ornamentalmind <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > *** whistles a few verses of Kýrie, eléison ***
>
> > >http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5F4wCNLYLOM
>
> > > On Aug 29, 10:44 am, Molly Brogan <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > > somehow we have come back to the cynical, in faultfinding, disbelief
> > > > in the sincerity of the motives of others, examination through sneer.
> > > > "if you bothered," relates distrust and disbelief, and separates the
> > > > "you" from the speaker. I think if the self is always central to
> > > > relationship - what "I" am saying and what is said to "me," it may be
> > > > easy to fall into the more egotistical or cynical view. In my
> > > > experience with relationships and groups, the exchange is more
> > > > seamless and less self centered, something more like Pat's exchange of
> > > > other within the one, that has a natural flow if indeed, we come from
> > > > this viewpoint and suspicions have fallen away. This is why I began
> > > > my examination with trust and trustworthiness and the comfort zone
> > > > therein, although in Pat's model, this is also seamless because all
> > > > intention is for the greater good if we are truly seen as one.
>
> > > > On Aug 29, 1:24 pm, BB47 <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > > > While you display much decorum, it is not like do not offer your own
> > > > > "cutting" opinions, at least from my view.
> > > > > Do I mean "cutting" as in "malicious?" No, not necessarily, and
> > > > > certainly not for the most part. Many things we say in here may be
> > > > > preceived as such, but "cutting" is also just an attempt to "cut
> > > > > through" to the "perceived truth" one might think or feel at this
> > > > > point in their lives. Most of what is said in these groups is an
> > > > > attempt to cut through, I really believe that, and not to cut others.
> > > > > Controlling how each message is received is very difficult! And yet
> > > > > just how they are perceived (as evident by the respose) "also" says
> > > > > something about each of us. It is all very complicated.
>
> > > > > While the bad kind of "cutting" happens too, it is often just dressed
> > > > > up in really nice decorum. I don't see that as any benefit, if it is
> > > > > really in there, in fact it makes the problem worse. But I am
> > > > > "trying" to view these posts as NOT having a malicious intent to them,
> > > > > after all, "we are all one...we are the mirror...how you treat others
> > > > > is how you treat yourself"...ect. ect. Well if you really believe
> > > > > those things then we need to look closer at just what we are saying,
> > > > > myself included. We might simply be trying to help by offering what
> > > > > we see as "not seen" or even the wacky idea of "the truth" even
> > > > > though we know we don't have it. It is so difficult to figure all
> > > > > this out, yet we keep trying. Put a gold star up there for "effort"
> > > > > on us human's report card for in trying to figure things out!
>
> > > > > Maybe my point is that some "need" to say some things, this is
> > > > > apparent, and the motive behind that need, while questionable, should
> > > > > not be judged too quickly. Some are more "direct" and "hold back
> > > > > less" but that does not necessarily mean they have "bad intent." I
> > > > > am not very good at holding back. This is obviously a danger and
> > > > > something that will no doubt "stir up" but honestly, I do not see
> > > > > that as a bad thing!
> > > > > does a painter try and "stir up" emotions? "Stir up" is also "a re-
> > > > > examination" isn't it? I realize there is a balance, and it may be
> > > > > easy for you, but not so easy for me. Expression is what we are here
> > > > > for. Does holding back expression do any good? Can we truly
> > > > > "protect" the receiver? Can we "insure" the "intent" of each post?
> > > > > We are obviously all different, and all take different approaches. If
> > > > > we assume bad intent, then there is going to be trouble. If we ignore
> > > > > what we see as bad intent there will be trouble too. I don't know the
> > > > > solution, but dressing up bad intent in a nice classy disguise does
> > > > > not seem to be the answer either. Not that you would do that! I
> > > > > believe you are a very nice person with genuine goals of seeking,
> > > > > feeling, learning, and you believe in harmony and peace. Those are
> > > > > wonderful qualities!
>
> > > > > As to Jim's OP, I do some adapting to other people, this is
> > > > > natural, but I am always myself. Are there different facets? Of
> > > > > course. Should we always "adapt?" I am not sure. If it violates
> > > > > something important in you I don't think so. Some core philosophy? No,
> > > > > but then that can be discussed. Everything needs to be discussed!
> > > > > That is my core philosophy! Hey, I discovered a new one! thanks for
> > > > > listening, if you bothered.
>
> > > > > On Aug 29, 6:05 am, Molly Brogan <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > I had to give this one some thought, Jim, and examine the way that I
> > > > > > interact in a group. I'm not sure what you are going for here, but
> > > > > > for me, relationship and group dynamic always has time coming in and
> > > > > > going out aspects. I cannot say that I behave the same everywhere I
> > > > > > go, because I find myself sizing up the environment to establish a
> > > > > > comfort zone for the exchange - what others are comfortable with,
> > > > > > what
> > > > > > I am comfortable offering. Issues of trust and trustworthiness are
> > > > > > present in every relationship and group, and they can take awhile to
> > > > > > establish. But even if the group is only together for an evening,
> > > > > > there will be a getting to know you period, a bonding period, a
> > > > > > deconstructive period, and a coming together before separating
> > > > > > period. Happens every time.
>
> > > > > > I also choose the topic for discussion based on the receiver's
> > > > > > receptivity. I don't try to discuss Esoteric philosophy unless I
> > > > > > first see interest and foundational knowledge. I have found that
> > > > > > allowing people their comfort zone can bring the best out in them.
> > > > > > However, there is also an edge where they will begin to feel
> > > > > > threatened and challenged if they are taken beyond it. I have
> > > > > > noticed
> > > > > > that some people prey on this, and like to disturb and stir things
> > > > > > up. I take the other route, as my mother taught me that ladies and
> > > > > > gentlemen do what they can to make everyone around them comfortable,
> > > > > > and it is a good way to live. I think there is something to be said
> > > > > > for this kind of virtuous nobility.
>
> > > > > > All of this is to say that, while I am always me, I respect those
> > > > > > around me in each exchange, which gives particular flavor to each
> > > > > > exchange and may bring up different aspects, as you say, in me.
>
> > > > > > On Aug 28, 2:19 pm, retiredjim34 <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > I thought for a long time that I was the same “me”
> > > > > > > wherever I
> > > > > > > was and whoever I was with. But then, in recent decades, I began
> > > > > > > to
> > > > > > > notice differences in the “me” that was present, first with a few
> > > > > > > people, then more and more with more and more. For example, I
> > > > > > > might be
> > > > > > > witty with fast comebacks with one person, and yet with another I
> > > > > > > was
> > > > > > > more dull and boring. Even when I tried to lighten up with the
> > > > > > > second
> > > > > > > person, I did not seem able to – I couldn’t call forth the facet
> > > > > > > of me
> > > > > > > that was present with the first person. Hmmm.
> > > > > > > Have any of you noticed this? Probably everyone has, and
> > > > > > > just
> > > > > > > as probably many have written about it. Do any of you know if
> > > > > > > this is
> > > > > > > the case? And has anyone tried to explain the different facets of
> > > > > > > one’s personality that seem to naturally shine with different
> > > > > > > people?
> > > > > > > Or am I just nuts? Jim- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
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> > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
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> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
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