I hope your word holds true 'cause we've been paying more than enough to the truly dedicated forgetting information due to their irrelevancy.
On 28 Feb., 21:52, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > I agree Molly and would extend the idea in a number of ways. The > problem is that there is no real interest. > > On 28 Feb, 16:30, Molly <[email protected]> wrote: > > > if you run across anyone willing to fund such a project (and if it is > > truly dedicated to presenting ALL relevant information) I would love > > to be hired to pull it off, as I see it as ultimately valuable. A big > > project for sure, and one that would take research, design and > > maintenance to keep value and integrity. the industry of health care > > is currently based on the economic model, each facet of the industry > > scrapping for its share of the bucks - doctors, hospitals, insurance, > > pharmaceutical, alternatives or complementary medicines. Each branch > > has within it a core integrity, and each can be sited in its corrupt > > practices. It is a failing system because it is driven by economics > > instead of health. In the end, we each take charge of our own well > > being, researching alternatives and accessing resources and methods > > that we believe most effective. Our ability to access information is > > important in this. That believe itself may or may not be the pivotal > > factor, depending on our own state of being. > > > On Feb 27, 10:52 pm, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > In real research one has to look at a massive number of sources. Many > > > papers, even in peer review these days are worthless, or as near as > > > damnit, especially if viewed without much knowledge of what is really > > > being done in the experiments. Antibiotics work in two main ways - > > > some as antiseptics that attack the germs, some that corral the germs > > > to allow the immune system time to form antibodies. When one sees the > > > results of really effective treatments being described pretty simple > > > experimentation and numbers makes this clear cut, a bit like the > > > effects of bleach or decent hygiene. Much science is not like this. > > > Orn is right we are being hornswaggled. > > > The answer to type 2 diabetes probably lies in dolphins - they can > > > switch it on and off. So we are after the genetic connection, hoping > > > to find the switch, hoping we have it and so on. I doubt praying will > > > help, but I'm also sure faith in giant pharma profits isn't much help > > > either. Lots of drugs work by getting the body to do something by > > > signalling. We may be learning to develop new ways of such > > > signalling. Placebo is interesting because it seems we can 'con' > > > ourselves into such 'signalling'. This is something we lose as we > > > differentiate, and stem cells don't. > > > > There is a classic con going on similar to what Orn is pointing to in > > > the political use of 'statistics'. The methods employed are > > > completely corrupted. Doctors are by no means 'immune'. The classic > > > con is to ask irrelevant populations what they think is happening and > > > not to ask the obviously relevant population or work out what makes > > > such a specific population relevant, different and so on. Some of > > > what's going on is so bad it's like giving acupuncture to people > > > bleeding to death and concluding it don't work, or giving it to groups > > > likely to survive and then asking the grateful relatives and patients > > > whether they think it does. > > > > We could have web sites where all relevant information is published > > > and available free so discussions and evaluation would not be done > > > without the basic data - yet we don't. > > > > On 24 Feb, 15:37, ornamentalmind <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > As is the case with science and other relative pursuits… I > > > > provisionally accept specific memes that appear to be rational and/or > > > > make sense to me for some reason or another until I learn otherwise. > > > > So, I’ve ‘asked’ a lot of questions about big pharma as well as things > > > > religious. The ongoing process finds me at specific points of > > > > understanding at any given moment that are always subject to change… > > > > moving up or down the scale. > > > > > On Feb 24, 2:31 am, Lee <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > Then ask a lot. ;¬) > > > > > > On 23 Feb, 18:24, ornamentalmind <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > "... It's all about trust and questioning the motives of > > > > > > such soruces though isn't it?" - Lee > > > > > > > Perhaps ....but that alone is asking a lot. > > > > > > > On Feb 23, 3:54 am, Lee <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > Hah yes indeed OM, we can all find sources which prove black is > > > > > > > white > > > > > > > and white is red. It's all about trust and questioning the > > > > > > > motives of > > > > > > > such soruces though isn't it? > > > > > > > > On 23 Feb, 11:44, ornamentalmind <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > One can find research to support almost any point of view Lee. > > > > > > > > >http://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=placebo+effect+cancer&hl=en&as_sd... > > > > > > > > > A Wired UK article just told us a dirty little secret that the > > > > > > > > pharmaceutical drug world would rather keep quiet. That fact > > > > > > > > is: drugs > > > > > > > > are having a difficult time beating the placebo effect, and > > > > > > > > increasingly so. In fact, they're finding the placebo effect is > > > > > > > > getting stronger in people, making it more difficult for drugs > > > > > > > > to show > > > > > > > > any improvement over it. The credit for the increased placebo > > > > > > > > effect > > > > > > > > has been attributed to the increase in consumer advertising, > > > > > > > > which > > > > > > > > makes many consumers "believe" more in the drugs and their > > > > > > > > effects. > > > > > > > > Because the placebo effect is getting stronger, many widely > > > > > > > > distributed drugs would have had a hard time getting approval > > > > > > > > to begin > > > > > > > > with, if they were tested against today's placebo effect. Many > > > > > > > > drugs, > > > > > > > > notably Prozac, have also been shown to falter when compared to > > > > > > > > placebo - after they're already on the > > > > > > > > markethttp://www.naturalnews.com/027129_placebo_placebo_effect_drugs.html > > > > > > > > > Psych Drug Shocker: Antidepressant Drugs Work No Better than > > > > > > > > Placebo; > > > > > > > > Big Pharma Hoax Finally > > > > > > > > Exposedhttp://www.naturalnews.com/022723_placebo_depression_antidepressants.... > > > > > > > > > Is acupuncture nothing more than a dressed-up placebo effect? > > > > > > > > Not > > > > > > > > according to a recent joint MIT-Harvard Medical School clinical > > > > > > > > study. > > > > > > > > The study, published in the November 2008 issue of the > > > > > > > > peer-reviewed > > > > > > > > science journal Behavioural Brain Research, utilized functional > > > > > > > > magnetic resonance imaging (fMRI) and positron emission > > > > > > > > tomography > > > > > > > > (PET) to examine the effects of acupuncture in relieving > > > > > > > > pain.http://www.naturalnews.com/025057_acupuncture_placebo_the_brain.html > > > > > > > > > Even though placebos do not act on the disease, they seem to > > > > > > > > have an > > > > > > > > effect in about 1 out of 3 > > > > > > > > patients.http://www.cancer.org/docroot/ETO/content/ETO_5_3x_Placebo_Effect.asp > > > > > > > > > Placebos have helped alleviate pain, depression, anxiety, > > > > > > > > Parkinson's > > > > > > > > disease, inflammatory disorders and even cancer. > > > > > > > > Placebo Effect: A Cure in the Mind > > > > > > > > Belief is powerful medicine, even if the treatment itself is a > > > > > > > > sham. > > > > > > > > New research shows placeboes can also benefit patients who have > > > > > > > > no > > > > > > > > faith in > > > > > > > > them.http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=placebo-effect-a-cur... > > > > > > > > > On Feb 23, 1:49 am, Lee <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > I don't think we can rule out the power of placebo, but on > > > > > > > > > the other > > > > > > > > > hand I can see it doing something like cancer no good at all. > > > > > > > > > In fact > > > > > > > > > I recall there was a study done last year umm perhaps the > > > > > > > > > year before > > > > > > > > > that? About the effect the power of a positive attitude can > > > > > > > > > have on > > > > > > > > > cancer patients. There is no effect. > > > > > > > > > > On 22 Feb, 16:01, ornamentalmind <[email protected]> > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > The link to the study of physicians I posted months ago > > > > > > > > > > that concluded > > > > > > > > > > from them that as much as 80% of their treatments were > > > > > > > > > > consciously > > > > > > > > > > associated or centered upon a placebo effect I found > > > > > > > > > > astonishing but > > > > > > > > > > instructive. > > > > > > > > > > > On Feb 22, 7:32 am, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm with the MP's > > > > > > > > > > > > They argued the effectiveness was often unpredictable and > > > > > > > > > > > involved a > > > > > > > > > > > deception by the medical establishment. (This makes > > > > > > > > > > > sense if there is > > > > > > > > > > > any placebo effect with the treatment then there > > > > > > > > > > > essentially is no > > > > > > > > > > > treatment) > > > > > > > > > > > > They also warned it could lead to a delay in diagnosis if > > > > > > > > > > > symptoms > > > > > > > > > > > were cured but the underlying reason for them was not > > > > > > > > > > > tackled. > > > > > > > > > > > (I would agree with that and have to add relapse may > > > > > > > > > > > occur later on > > > > > > > > > > > with the lack of diagnostic information) > > > > > > > > > > > > The MPs also criticised the drugs regulator, the > > > > > > > > > > > Medicines and > > > > > > > > > > > Healthcare products Regulatory Agency, for allowing > > > > > > > > > > > medical claims to > > > > > > > > > > > be made. (I don't understand how medical claims could be > > > > > > > > > > > made on such > > > > > > > > > > > treatment > > > > > > > > > > > > Now if the politicians would apply this type of scrutiny > > > > > > > > > > > to all other > > > > > > > > > > > areas of running the country, I think things might well > > > > > > > > > > > improve Lee! > > > > > > > > > > > > On Feb 22, 5:55 am, Lee <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > What do we make of this? > > > > > > > > > > > > >http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/8524926.stm > > > > > > > > > > > > > Bloody good idea, what! > > > > > > > > > > > > > It somewhat restores my faith in politicians.- Hide > > > > > > > > > > > > quoted text - > > > > > > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > > > > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > > > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > ... > > Erfahren Sie mehr » -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye?hl=en.
