I'm more materialist than RP in that I see religion as more to do with what we do with and for each other - this said I prefer private prayer to collective knee-bending. How does tolerance fare once religionists become 'so pure' they can treat anyone else as infidel?
On Dec 10, 1:33 am, James <[email protected]> wrote: > The original post, that is, hmm sorry. :) > > On 12/9/2012 5:40 PM, James wrote: > > > > > > > > > RP, I have been considering your post and have taken it in the view of a > > biological perspective. It is one that I do think important but I am > > still left wondering why to attach such significance in an exclusive > > sense. It may be that I am overthinking the concept, it is one that I > > hold respect for but not to a degree of conclusiveness. Is there more I > > should examine? > > > Browsing the TimesOfIndia recently I found talk about the common views > > on China and worry over world dominance. I imagine there are vicious > > clashes between them and the Arab speaking regions, it seems unfortunate > > perhaps like being surrounded by strong interests on each side. I > > obviously have little political world knowledge. :) > > > On 12/9/2012 1:15 PM, RP Singh wrote: > >> Religion is first and foremost about prayer and worship. There is no > >> need for that but we must accept a morality code and adhere by it , > >> there should be a feeling of love for one's fellow creatures and > >> tolerance towards them. > > >> On Sun, Dec 9, 2012 at 8:41 PM, archytas<[email protected]> wrote: > >>> Given what they have done with some decent spiritual messages Allan, I > >>> sometimes think of 'them' as Xstains. I was born into the tradition, > >>> but thought it was twaddle by the time Sunday school was interfering > >>> with soccer and cricket. I have no doubt we should focus more on > >>> spirituality, fellowship, hospitality, goodwill and sensitivity to > >>> others. I just don't want to base this on a pack of lies, banning > >>> women from hierarchies, prejudicing gays and xenophobic stuff about > >>> outsiders and being part of god's chosen. It's hard to think like > >>> this without being prejudiced against the 'worshipers of the blue and > >>> white striped rabbit' and purveyors of godswank. The inner danger is > >>> becoming religiously anti-religious. I'm actually rather touched by > >>> good aspects of some of the stuff. > >>> I have no idea why we are clinging to this rock - but I don't want it > >>> to be about being amused by Aussie pranksters making hoax calls or > >>> murals celebrating vile killing such as one finds in the Vatican. > >>> Science clearly provides us no answers to our spiritual plight and > >>> religion as I witness it internally is largely about future memory > >>> with less myth in it and less reason to take religion as we might > >>> otherwise take opiates. > >>> A colleague working in India is saying his students are reading Mein > >>> Kampf - more or less replacing the word Jew with Muslim and agreeing > >>> the plot entirely. We could do with some sensible religion and > >>> economics to fill the void that leaves people this vulnerable. > >>> Knowledge of thermodynamics or the biochemistry of life isn't going to > >>> do that for us. > > >>> On Dec 8, 10:01 am, Allan H<[email protected]> wrote: > >>>> xtian aka christianity > > >>>> On Sat, Dec 8, 2012 at 8:02 AM, rigs<[email protected]> wrote: > >>>>> It depends on what religion you are referring to. Very funny line > >>>>> about Pilate! :-) > > >>>>> On Dec 6, 4:09 am, archytas<[email protected]> wrote: > >>>>>> Sounds like something Pontius Pilate might have used. > > >>>>>> I guess that David Deutsch and constructor theory tries to get > >>>>>> back to > >>>>>> reminding science about its root guesses Allan. I take from > >>>>>> 'Spartacus Ants' sacrificing themselves to destroy slaver ants that > >>>>>> pre-human biology 'knows' something of survival instinct. > > >>>>>> Descartes had it that until we could get to a point of re-evaluating > >>>>>> against his radical doubt one had to trust in a beneficent god. > >>>>>> Whilst we can criticize his system, I think anti-religious science > >>>>>> misses the beat on issues of how we can live until we know more. The > >>>>>> spiritual thus has its place. There is plenty to avoid in its history > >>>>>> of control fraud, abuse, sexism and war crimes - but plenty to learn > >>>>>> in terms of grace and fellowship. > > >>>>>> On 6 Dec, 08:15, Allan H<[email protected]> wrote: > > >>>>>>> it is not for cleaning hands ,, it just gets rid of smell that you > >>>>>>> can not get rid of no matter how much you wash.. you just wash after > >>>>>>> youor hands are clean,, then the smell is gone. > >>>>>>> Allan > > >>>>>>> On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 11:27 PM, gabbydott<[email protected]> > >>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>> Hm, I have never thought of using a steel soap bar for cleaning > >>>>>>>> my hands. I > >>>>>>>> use it occasionally for my pots and pans. And for the more > >>>>>>>> difficult dirt on > >>>>>>>> my hands I use a pumice stone or lemon. And more and more often > >>>>>>>> I wear > >>>>>>>> gloves or buy frozen and precut garlic and onion. But thanks for > >>>>>>>> the tip. > >>>>>>>> I'm sure that one day I'll make use of it. Why not steel instead > >>>>>>>> of stone, > >>>>>>>> you're right. > > >>>>>>>> On Tuesday, December 4, 2012 7:54:42 PM UTC+1, Allan Heretic wrote: > > >>>>>>>>> Well actually Gabby I have this stainless steel soap bar used for > >>>>>>>>> getting rid of ordure off your hands things like onion, Garlic ,, > >>>>>>>>> any strong ordure ,, just tried it on the epoxy smell left over > >>>>>>>>> from > >>>>>>>>> fixing my maxi egg coddler. > > >>>>>>>>> now one of the greatest mysteries of the universe,, how does it > >>>>>>>>> work? > >>>>>>>>> Allan > > >>>>>>>>> On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 6:38 PM, gabbydott<[email protected]> > >>>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>> The pointlessness of the points' business. Like Lee, I find > >>>>>>>>>> the God > >>>>>>>>>> concept > >>>>>>>>>> much more to the point. :) > > >>>>>>>>>> I don't follow Lee's sequencing model - first spirit, then > >>>>>>>>>> matter - > >>>>>>>>>> though. > >>>>>>>>>> This sounds very man-made to me. ;) > > >>>>>>>>>> As for the storytelling aspect, yes, the Chronos story is much > >>>>>>>>>> more > >>>>>>>>>> vivid > >>>>>>>>>> than the "God created (x) and saw it was good" story. That's > >>>>>>>>>> true. But > >>>>>>>>>> the > >>>>>>>>>> children are less likely to have bad dreams at night. Which is > >>>>>>>>>> really > >>>>>>>>>> good. > > >>>>>>>>>> Sorry, Allan, I got carried away. What were you talking about? > > >>>>>>>>>> 2012/12/4 Allan H<[email protected]> > > >>>>>>>>>>> a series of creation is at best a wild guess with no supporting > >>>>>>>>>>> evidence.. > >>>>>>>>>>> Allan > > >>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 4:42 PM, RP Singh<[email protected]> > >>>>>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>> You can pinpoint the beginning of this universe but not that of > >>>>>>>>>>>> Creation with its series of universes. > > >>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 9:03 PM, Allan H<[email protected]> > >>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>> That is not true the beginning can be pretty much > >>>>>>>>>>>>> pinpointed .. as > >>>>>>>>>>>>> for > >>>>>>>>>>>>> parallel universes that is just a wild guess with nothing > >>>>>>>>>>>>> to support > >>>>>>>>>>>>> the > >>>>>>>>>>>>> other than it sounds good. There is more evidence > >>>>>>>>>>>>> supporting the > >>>>>>>>>>>>> spiritual > >>>>>>>>>>>>> realm than parallel universes > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Allan > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> Matrix ** th3 beginning light > > >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Dec 4, 2012 2:26 PM, "RP Singh"<[email protected]> wrote: > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> In my view there is no beginning to creation. There is > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> beginning > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> and > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> end to universes There are infinite no. of universes in > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> parallel > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> and > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> continuously many universes are being born and many are > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> dying , > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> but > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Creation which includes infinite universes in eternal time > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> , just > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> like > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the Spirit, is without beginning and without end. The > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> difference is > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> that the nature of creation is dualistic and the Spirit is > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> non-dual. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 5:34 PM, Lee > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Douglas<[email protected]> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello Andrew, > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Heh I can envisage many things, but alas many of them are > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> not > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> true. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> distinguish between two things, matter and spirit. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mattter is > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> all > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> physical, which includes physical 'matter' and also > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> energy. To > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> me > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> there > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> no paradox of who created the creator. Before the > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> begining there > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> was > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> only > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> God, God in spirit, and God created the creation out of > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the spirt > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> God. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That is all matter comes from spirit. > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Friday, 30 November 2012 18:32:43 UTC, andrew vecsey > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Lee, I can see where all matter has to have an energy > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> component > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> because matter is manifested as atoms which have motion > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in them. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> But I > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> could > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> also envision pure motion without involving any > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> atoms...like a > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> vibration in > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the fabric of space, > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Friday, November 30, 2012 5:53:26 PM UTC+1, Lee Douglas > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Heh except of course that when it comes right down to > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it.energy > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> matter > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and matter is energy. > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Friday, 30 November 2012 11:22:14 UTC, andrew vecsey > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: > > ... > > read more » --
