Which lie did I tell??
2012/12/10 Allan H <[email protected]> > I know very well Gabby,, it has taken legs of its own.. the truth is > yo have to stop the lies and tell the truth not cover it up with more > lies.. where there is error it needs to be corrected.. yes it means > rewriting history and let the truth have its legs and give it a > chance.. yes and it has lead spirituality down a path.. One of the > problems is the spirituality that Jesus taught has nothing to do with > crucifixion at all.. people want to claim a easy way out.. rather > than have to understand what he taught .. there are a lot of people > who really do understand the spirituality ... the leadership is > there .. it is the lack of spiritual leadership... probably because > they can not face the earlier deception .. > Allan > > On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 5:19 PM, gabbydott <[email protected]> wrote: > > I don't know, Allan. This way of telling the story is underestimating the > > power of cause and effect, the timeline (often seen as leglessly > moving, > > non-blinking , poisonous) that allows us to make judgements and correct > our > > views - and our path will follow. The poisonous snake bite is as true > and > > led us to our here and now as Jesus is the spiritual creator of the > > Autobahnen on which we will be travelling on Godspeed. Jesusswank in full > > effect. > > > > > > > > 2012/12/9 Allan H <[email protected]> > >> > >> I was raised in the same atmosphere.. the only difference was my father > >> was a convert and it seriously meant something.. > >> the church of england is on the sideline,, they did that when the king > >> took control of spirituality so he could have a divorce.. > >> > >> The problems in christianity lies in its foundation.. the errors and > >> problems they built in from the beginning.. minor things like Paul's > >> healing from a snake bite.. that is a lie.. there are no poisonous > >> snakes on Malta.. Yes it is hard but you have clean house.. that is > the > >> beginning o real and meaningful change.. not administrative garbage.. > >> > >> Oddly it can be made to fit and as spirituality goes it really is not > >> bad, and you will have dual churches and dual beliefs.. but over time > you > >> can end the lies,, mostly by not hiding form them .. it get down to > >> telling the simple truth rather than the comforting lie. > >> > >> Many people will not be able to accept the change,, and that is okay,, > >> the wheels of change need to start rolling.. by going through all the > past > >> and what is a lie admit to it and correct it,, bringing it back to one > >> faith. > >> > >> only a few will ever really find he path Jesus created > >> Allan > >> > >> Matrix ** th3 beginning light > >> > >> On Dec 9, 2012 4:11 PM, "archytas" <[email protected]> wrote: > >>> > >>> Given what they have done with some decent spiritual messages Allan, I > >>> sometimes think of 'them' as Xstains. I was born into the tradition, > >>> but thought it was twaddle by the time Sunday school was interfering > >>> with soccer and cricket. I have no doubt we should focus more on > >>> spirituality, fellowship, hospitality, goodwill and sensitivity to > >>> others. I just don't want to base this on a pack of lies, banning > >>> women from hierarchies, prejudicing gays and xenophobic stuff about > >>> outsiders and being part of god's chosen. It's hard to think like > >>> this without being prejudiced against the 'worshipers of the blue and > >>> white striped rabbit' and purveyors of godswank. The inner danger is > >>> becoming religiously anti-religious. I'm actually rather touched by > >>> good aspects of some of the stuff. > >>> I have no idea why we are clinging to this rock - but I don't want it > >>> to be about being amused by Aussie pranksters making hoax calls or > >>> murals celebrating vile killing such as one finds in the Vatican. > >>> Science clearly provides us no answers to our spiritual plight and > >>> religion as I witness it internally is largely about future memory > >>> with less myth in it and less reason to take religion as we might > >>> otherwise take opiates. > >>> A colleague working in India is saying his students are reading Mein > >>> Kampf - more or less replacing the word Jew with Muslim and agreeing > >>> the plot entirely. We could do with some sensible religion and > >>> economics to fill the void that leaves people this vulnerable. > >>> Knowledge of thermodynamics or the biochemistry of life isn't going to > >>> do that for us. > >>> > >>> On Dec 8, 10:01 am, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote: > >>> > xtian aka christianity > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > On Sat, Dec 8, 2012 at 8:02 AM, rigs <[email protected]> wrote: > >>> > > It depends on what religion you are referring to. Very funny line > >>> > > about Pilate! :-) > >>> > > >>> > > On Dec 6, 4:09 am, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > >>> > >> Sounds like something Pontius Pilate might have used. > >>> > > >>> > >> I guess that David Deutsch and constructor theory tries to get > back > >>> > >> to > >>> > >> reminding science about its root guesses Allan. I take from > >>> > >> 'Spartacus Ants' sacrificing themselves to destroy slaver ants > that > >>> > >> pre-human biology 'knows' something of survival instinct. > >>> > > >>> > >> Descartes had it that until we could get to a point of > re-evaluating > >>> > >> against his radical doubt one had to trust in a beneficent god. > >>> > >> Whilst we can criticize his system, I think anti-religious science > >>> > >> misses the beat on issues of how we can live until we know more. > >>> > >> The > >>> > >> spiritual thus has its place. There is plenty to avoid in its > >>> > >> history > >>> > >> of control fraud, abuse, sexism and war crimes - but plenty to > learn > >>> > >> in terms of grace and fellowship. > >>> > > >>> > >> On 6 Dec, 08:15, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote: > >>> > > >>> > >> > it is not for cleaning hands ,, it just gets rid of smell that > >>> > >> > you > >>> > >> > can not get rid of no matter how much you wash.. you just wash > >>> > >> > after > >>> > >> > youor hands are clean,, then the smell is gone. > >>> > >> > Allan > >>> > > >>> > >> > On Wed, Dec 5, 2012 at 11:27 PM, gabbydott <[email protected] > > > >>> > >> > wrote: > >>> > >> > > Hm, I have never thought of using a steel soap bar for > cleaning > >>> > >> > > my hands. I > >>> > >> > > use it occasionally for my pots and pans. And for the more > >>> > >> > > difficult dirt on > >>> > >> > > my hands I use a pumice stone or lemon. And more and more > often > >>> > >> > > I wear > >>> > >> > > gloves or buy frozen and precut garlic and onion. But thanks > for > >>> > >> > > the tip. > >>> > >> > > I'm sure that one day I'll make use of it. Why not steel > instead > >>> > >> > > of stone, > >>> > >> > > you're right. > >>> > > >>> > >> > > On Tuesday, December 4, 2012 7:54:42 PM UTC+1, Allan Heretic > >>> > >> > > wrote: > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> Well actually Gabby I have this stainless steel soap bar > used > >>> > >> > >> for > >>> > >> > >> getting rid of ordure off your hands things like onion, > >>> > >> > >> Garlic ,, > >>> > >> > >> any strong ordure ,, just tried it on the epoxy smell left > >>> > >> > >> over from > >>> > >> > >> fixing my maxi egg coddler. > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> now one of the greatest mysteries of the universe,, how does > >>> > >> > >> it work? > >>> > >> > >> Allan > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 6:38 PM, gabbydott <[email protected] > > > >>> > >> > >> wrote: > >>> > >> > >> > The pointlessness of the points' business. Like Lee, I find > >>> > >> > >> > the God > >>> > >> > >> > concept > >>> > >> > >> > much more to the point. :) > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> > I don't follow Lee's sequencing model - first spirit, then > >>> > >> > >> > matter - > >>> > >> > >> > though. > >>> > >> > >> > This sounds very man-made to me. ;) > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> > As for the storytelling aspect, yes, the Chronos story is > >>> > >> > >> > much more > >>> > >> > >> > vivid > >>> > >> > >> > than the "God created (x) and saw it was good" story. > That's > >>> > >> > >> > true. But > >>> > >> > >> > the > >>> > >> > >> > children are less likely to have bad dreams at night. Which > >>> > >> > >> > is really > >>> > >> > >> > good. > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> > Sorry, Allan, I got carried away. What were you talking > >>> > >> > >> > about? > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> > 2012/12/4 Allan H <[email protected]> > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> >> a series of creation is at best a wild guess with no > >>> > >> > >> >> supporting > >>> > >> > >> >> evidence.. > >>> > >> > >> >> Allan > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> >> On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 4:42 PM, RP Singh < > [email protected]> > >>> > >> > >> >> wrote: > >>> > >> > >> >> > You can pinpoint the beginning of this universe but not > >>> > >> > >> >> > that of > >>> > >> > >> >> > Creation with its series of universes. > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> >> > On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 9:03 PM, Allan H > >>> > >> > >> >> > <[email protected]> wrote: > >>> > >> > >> >> >> That is not true the beginning can be pretty much > >>> > >> > >> >> >> pinpointed .. as > >>> > >> > >> >> >> for > >>> > >> > >> >> >> parallel universes that is just a wild guess with > nothing > >>> > >> > >> >> >> to support > >>> > >> > >> >> >> the > >>> > >> > >> >> >> other than it sounds good. There is more evidence > >>> > >> > >> >> >> supporting the > >>> > >> > >> >> >> spiritual > >>> > >> > >> >> >> realm than parallel universes > >>> > >> > >> >> >> Allan > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> >> >> Matrix ** th3 beginning light > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> >> >> On Dec 4, 2012 2:26 PM, "RP Singh" <[email protected]> > >>> > >> > >> >> >> wrote: > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> In my view there is no beginning to creation. There is > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> beginning > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> and > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> end to universes There are infinite no. of universes > in > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> parallel > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> and > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> continuously many universes are being born and many > are > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> dying , > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> but > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> Creation which includes infinite universes in eternal > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> time , just > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> like > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> the Spirit, is without beginning and without end. The > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> difference is > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> that the nature of creation is dualistic and the > Spirit > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> is > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> non-dual. > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> On Tue, Dec 4, 2012 at 5:34 PM, Lee Douglas > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> <[email protected]> > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> wrote: > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > Hello Andrew, > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > Heh I can envisage many things, but alas many of > them > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > are not > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > true. > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > I > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > distinguish between two things, matter and spirit. > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > Mattter is > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > all > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > that > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > is > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > physical, which includes physical 'matter' and also > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > energy. To > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > me > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > there > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > is > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > no paradox of who created the creator. Before the > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > begining there > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > was > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > only > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > God, God in spirit, and God created the creation out > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > of the spirt > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > of > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > God. > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > That is all matter comes from spirit. > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > On Friday, 30 November 2012 18:32:43 UTC, andrew > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> > vecsey wrote: > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >> Lee, I can see where all matter has to have an > energy > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >> component > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >> to > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >> it > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >> because matter is manifested as atoms which have > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >> motion in them. > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >> But I > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >> could > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >> also envision pure motion without involving any > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >> atoms...like a > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >> vibration in > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >> the fabric of space, > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >> On Friday, November 30, 2012 5:53:26 PM UTC+1, Lee > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >> Douglas > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >> wrote: > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>> Heh except of course that when it comes right down > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>> to it.energy > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>> is > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>> matter > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>> and matter is energy. > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>> On Friday, 30 November 2012 11:22:14 UTC, andrew > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>> vecsey wrote: > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> The paradoxical dilemma of who created the > creator > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> can be > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> circumnavigated by the possibility that the > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> original creator > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> was > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> not > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> matter, > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> but energy. Just like thinking of anything is > much > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> faster and > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> much > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> easier > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> than building it, it becomes conceivable that > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> energy patterns > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> could > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> have > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> evolved in a random chance way and finely tuned > by > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> selective > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> processes to > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> reach intelligence similar to how most scientists > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> believe that > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> patterns of > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> atoms and molecules evolved to form intelligent > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> life. > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> Energy patterns could have evolved to a point > that > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> they > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> manipulated > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> atoms to desired patterns and forms to code the > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> information > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> required > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> for > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> life and to allow them to evolve on their own to > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> complex > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> intelligent > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> beings > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> able to wonder at and eventually to solve the > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> riddle of where > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> they > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> came > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> from, where they are going and why they are > alive. > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> Meaning and > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> purpose could > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> then be given to our fleeting moment of > existence. > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> On Thursday, November 29, 2012 7:55:05 PM UTC+1, > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> archytas > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>> wrote: > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> ....... All we have in respect of this is to > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> posit > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> creation, begging the question of what created > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> that in an > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> infinite > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> regress. .....We might get to an intelligent > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> state in which > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> creation > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> myths are replaced by something more plausible > and > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> Truth > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> comes > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> closer. > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> On 29 Nov, 01:41, RP Singh <[email protected]> > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> wrote: > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > Neil , even after re-transposition how long > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > could the brain > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > live > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > --1000 years , 10000years or maybe as long as > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > the universe > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > ,but > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > ultimately it will die or be destroyed at the > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > end - time of > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > the > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > universe. What survives is the Truth behind > life > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > and > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > nothing > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > else. > >>> > > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 3:33 AM, archytas > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > <[email protected]> > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > wrote: > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > What survives is the gene - subject to > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > mutations etc. We > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > are > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > already > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > 'Borg' in the sense of mass assimilation. > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > One's mind > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > could > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > be > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > transposed to another substrate (nearish > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > future) - our > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > bodies > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > are > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > currently replaced every 5 years or so- and > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > the new > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > substrate > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > could > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > have nanobots that would allow minds to > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > outlive Lee's > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > 'hope'. > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > Such > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > substrated minds might link in > >>> > >> > >> >> >>> >>>>> > > super-intelligence and be > >>> > > >>> > ... > >>> > > >>> > read more ยป > >>> > >>> -- > >>> > >>> > >>> > >> -- > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > > -- > ( > ) > |_D Allan > > Life is for moral, ethical and truthful living. > > > I am a Natural Airgunner - > > Full of Hot Air & Ready To Expel It Quickly. > > -- > > > > --
