Must be a Cali only thing then. I've never seen one in any other car before late 1993
Sent from my iPhone > On Mar 25, 2016, at 9:51 AM, Holland Phillips <[email protected]> > wrote: > > I know that my '92 GTI 16V had a lot of emissions hardware that was specific > to California models. I remember when I would have the car smogged, they > would poke around the engine compartment for 15 or 20 minutes just checking > that all the hardware was there. I've never understood why California in > particular is so concerned about hardware inspection, when emissions is all > about what comes out the tail pipe. > > ~Holland > >> On Mar 25, 2016 06:55, "Les Noriel" <[email protected]> wrote: >> I was wondering if it was exclusively a california thing. My 90 Corrado had >> the connector underneath the shifter boot but I never really used it. >> On the other hand, I discovered in the Bentley, My 95 Jetta with the 2.0l >> motor had a small key underneath the rear seat. The key was inserted into >> the port in the console and with the ignition on, would provide me blink >> codes on the dashboard. >> >> Both were California cars when originally sold. >> >>> On Thu, Mar 24, 2016 at 10:37 PM, Holland Phillips >>> <[email protected]> wrote: >>> It's starting to sound like non California cars may not have what I've been >>> referring to as a check engine light. >>> My car was a California car from new. >>> The best ground on any car is the negative battery post. >>> The smell is very possibly the new cat, and the droning noise may be having >>> to do with the cat as well. You may want to check and see if the cat is >>> touching the heat shield that normally is between the cat and the floor of >>> the car. >>> Until you get the basic timing sorted out, I wouldn't worry about the cold >>> start issue. There is a cold start valve which is mounted to the intake >>> manifold, on the tranny end of the manifold. But if the car only takes a >>> couple of tries to fire when fully cold, the valve is probably working. >>> Sounds like you're on the home stretch, just double check the Bentley for >>> the exact basic timing procedure. >>> You could try and get the car smogged, just find a place that promises free >>> retests if you fail. Most smog stations in California do. >>> Hang in there, you've come a long way since your original post. >>> >>> ~Holland >>> >>>> On Mar 24, 2016 21:32, "damac2004" <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> hmm, i see nothing in my cluster about this light or a seperate switch in >>>> the dash. i see motronic has basic codes you can check with jumper and >>>> led with harness under shift boot. i will check my car tomorrow for that >>>> and see what happens. >>>> >>>> i tightened the distributor bolts and no go, timing light still jumps >>>> around. i tried various spots on the spark plug wire no change. i tried >>>> hooking up the timing light to the - post on coil to start like the bently >>>> talks about, this would illimunate light on my gun but it wouldn't flash, >>>> so i used the instructions for my gun and put it on the negative battery >>>> post? >>>> >>>> i'm not sure what to do here. i hate to spend all that $$$ on a new one >>>> for no reason. >>>> >>>> i got antsy and took the car out for a hard drive and it was definately a >>>> different experience than before. not sure if im crazy or if the cams, >>>> chip and intake could have made such a difference? >>>> >>>> now i have a cat on it and the car is much quiter walking around it at >>>> idle. the engine bay specifically, and so much so when driving i thought >>>> the car died multiple times when coming to a stop. to my ear i feel there >>>> is less crackling out the exhaust pipe, but it seems to me i hear and feel >>>> a new drone right under me when just coming off idle. i would have called >>>> it a hesitation and gurgle but i noticed it isn't directly related to the >>>> throttle when pusing it to go. on that front the car seems to react as >>>> good as ever without stumbling on the gas. that drone seems to go away >>>> when revving it out, and will come back at times when letting off the >>>> throttle. the car was always too loud for my liking when driving it but i >>>> don't really care at this point, i will get rid of it later anyway. >>>> >>>> i only drove for like 20 minutes and when i came back the car stunk. not >>>> like raw gas smell, i wonder if its the cat breaking in? of course they >>>> mention nothing about it. >>>> >>>> i am hoping i am on the home stretch here. i am tempted to just take it >>>> into smog but i have to assume my timing isn't perfect and am afraid of >>>> failing and having to go back :( >>>> >>>> only issue i noticed again is i turned the car off and it restarted right >>>> away. when i went out for the drive, maybe an hour after previously >>>> running the car had no life starting the first crank. second crank it >>>> sounded like it stumbled at the end. third crank it started and idled on >>>> its own. so is it safe to assume i have a problem with "cold" starting? >>>> it didn't use to act like this, it always showed signs of life. >>>> >>>>> On Thursday, March 24, 2016 at 7:11:16 PM UTC-7, hollandphillips wrote: >>>>> You're correct, there is no vacuum line attached to the ecu. But there is >>>>> definitely something that is supposed to be disconnected when setting >>>>> base timing. Since your chassis isn't a California car, there is probably >>>>> a lot of things that are different. Until the OBD2 spec came into effect >>>>> in, I think, '96, most new vehicles sold in the U.S. came in what was >>>>> termed "49 state" versions, and California versions. Thanks CARB & EPA. >>>>> Now almost all vehicles are "world spec", since the EU has become as >>>>> emissions aware as the U.S. has been for decades. They've even gone >>>>> further with the introduction of pedestrian accident requirements for >>>>> front bumbers, which I think the U.S. has or will be adopting. >>>>> >>>>> ~Holland >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 24, 2016 18:53, "damac2004" <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> the 2.0 im shaft fit into my block but the matching big gear wouldn't fit >>>>> in the smaller hole on the block that mates with the oil pump so i still >>>>> don't understand whats going on with this, but if i pass smog i won't >>>>> care :) >>>>> >>>>> unless i am missing something all i see for timing this car is to heat it >>>>> up with a fan cycle and go. no disconnecting the cts or revving like >>>>> some others??? i don't have any vacuum line on my ecu either. >>>>> >>>>> bently has a blurb that distributor bearings might be messed up if timing >>>>> wanders, ugh. maybe i had the bolts too loose i will go out and try and >>>>> tighten them and see. >>>>> >>>>> i see no engine light in my cluster either and the last smog guy i went >>>>> to was asking me where it was!!! its a non california car and i won't be >>>>> going back to that guy. >>>>> >>>>> On Thursday, March 24, 2016 at 5:52:49 PM UTC-7, hollandphillips wrote: >>>>> Two knock sensors means 2.0/9A block. >>>>> On the timing issue, there is something that needs to be disconnected >>>>> prior to using a timing light. I can't remember what exactly it is, but I >>>>> think it's a vacuum line somewhere. Again, that information is in the >>>>> Bentley. Once the whatever is disconnected, the timing should be steady >>>>> when viewed with the timing light. >>>>> The timing advance on Motronic cars is controlled by the ECU, which is >>>>> why initial setting of the timing requires disconnecting whatever it is >>>>> the Bentley tells you. They do connect a timing sensor to the number one >>>>> cylinder spark plug lead when running an emissions test in California. >>>>> Don't know if it's just for reference to the machine, or if they can >>>>> actually fail you if it's out of spec. >>>>> >>>>> ~Holland >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 24, 2016 17:04, "damac2004" <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> ok so ground showed no continuity to that sensor wire. it does with pin >>>>> 7 i believe on the ecu connector, so i guess i am good. i kept getting >>>>> confused because people were talking about an insulated wire and im >>>>> thinking a nasty cable like for tv. when looking these guys over as is, >>>>> they don't seem special looking to me. >>>>> >>>>> also i looked over the car again and i do have 2 knock sensors. they are >>>>> on the front of the block close to each, closer to cylinder #1. they >>>>> each attach to a harness connector that goes into the loom and to the >>>>> ecu. so if i remember right people said 1.8 blocks don't have 2? yet i >>>>> couldn't fit the larger im shaft gear into this block that mates to the >>>>> oil pump it had the smaller block off plate hole? so still not sure what >>>>> i have. in included a picture down below. hopefully i won't need to >>>>> care. >>>>> >>>>> here is a link to video of my first cold startup. for some reason it >>>>> took like 5 times to start like there was no gas, fuel pump was making >>>>> noise. then it started right up. can anybody tell if it sounds ok? i >>>>> am now having an issue with timing the car. i tried cold and after a >>>>> warmup cycle and i cannot get the pointer to stay still with the light >>>>> on? it kind of lines up with the diamond and then it will shoot off a >>>>> little bit off one way or the other. if i go further either way from >>>>> where it is now, when it shoots off it tends to go in that direction >>>>> more. i tried connecting the lead near the distributor cap and at the >>>>> head. it seems to like this spot the best but im not sure how accurate >>>>> it is. im wondering what impact this could have on smog if im a little >>>>> off. also not sure if this means my car is having troubles or if my >>>>> timing light is messed up. >>>>> >>>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GB9yXn61pS8 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Thursday, March 24, 2016 at 10:32:11 AM UTC-7, stevenarguello wrote: >>>>> I think that your loom is good, I wouldn’t mess with it anymore. The >>>>> Bentley shows a circle around the signal wire where that ground meets the >>>>> O2 signal wire instead of a splice and that’s what you have. Maybe check >>>>> to be sure that there’s no continuity between the ground and the O2 >>>>> signal spade connector. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 24, 2016, at 10:48 AM, Holland Phillips <[email protected]> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> The Motronic ECU does store codes. Since the OBD1 spec didn't go into >>>>> effect until '95, code readers don't work on these cars. Connecting two >>>>> leads to the proper positions of the connectors under the shifter boot >>>>> and connecting a momentary switch to the other ends of the two leads, by >>>>> using the switch to short the leads for a few seconds, the codes are >>>>> shown by the check engine light flashing in various sequences. The >>>>> Bentley explains all this and has a chart showing what the various codes >>>>> indicate. I don't remember exactly where in the Bentley this procedure >>>>> is, but it's in there somewhere. >>>>> >>>>> ~Holland >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 24, 2016 1:17 AM, "damac2004" <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> sorry just to make sure we are on the same page. you are saying the 02 >>>>> sensor black connector is going into the loom to the ecu. and the ground >>>>> wire attached to the firewall is loose and surrounding the 02 sensor wire >>>>> along the same path? i am paranoid and want to see for myself and am >>>>> tempted to cut further upstream to see. >>>>> >>>>> i thought i read about the codes and bought a cord on ebay to convert >>>>> from a little plug underneath the shifter boot i believe that goes to an >>>>> obd reader? i will try it if i read right after i get the sucker going, >>>>> had to rewire the main power and grounds. many wires have fallen to >>>>> pieces just from touching them. scary stuff now that i look closer. >>>>> >>>>> On Thursday, March 24, 2016 at 12:40:03 AM UTC-7, stevenarguello wrote: >>>>> The picture looks just like what I thought it would, the signal wire is >>>>> the one with the connector, the one going to the ground is the shield. I >>>>> think that you're good to go. >>>>> I would have shown you my loom, but it's very different and I thought >>>>> it'd make things more confusing. >>>>> >>>>> Fire it up. >>>>> >>>>> One last thing, I'm pretty sure that your Motronic ecu has codes. I'm not >>>>> sure how easy they are to read or if they help at all. >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 24, 2016, at 1:29 AM, damac2004 <[email protected]> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> i forgot to add this picture. maybe i need to look closer but it looked >>>>> like the connector wire is exposed and touching that main ground leg. is >>>>> it possible the connector has its own cover and is running inside inside >>>>> the ground run? i can try and cut some back and look at it. i was >>>>> expecting a special looking wire, my connector wire doesn't look special? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> i don't really understand how to read the bently. this is the only wire >>>>> i see connected in the 20 pages to the firewall ground on that side. it >>>>> doesn't show a straight run to the control unit but it has a solid line >>>>> crossing into the shielded wire icon on the 02 sensor connected leg. i >>>>> just assumed they were connected or else the ground wire from firewall >>>>> side would go nowhere? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> is this a pretty common harness on other gas vw's of the same era? i >>>>> wish i could see somebodies stock harness with pictures, maybe i can find >>>>> one at picknpull. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ... >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>>> "MK2-16v" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>>> email to [email protected]. >>>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >>>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/mk2-16v. >>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mk2-16v/9f7a1bc8-67b6-427d-8d49-2b068b3af150%40googlegroups.com. >>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "MK2-16v" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>> email to [email protected]. >>> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >>> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/mk2-16v. >>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mk2-16v/CABrbKB%3D%3DBUGDF1C6OGpz3UQMG3DWPh8Hk6zKdujwt%3D0dDDspMA%40mail.gmail.com. >>> >>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "MK2-16v" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/mk2-16v. >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mk2-16v/CAEpuu2NGdSPGpQhBsFkupvuimd8AXFr8gRxOT2TXnUqQkgYa_g%40mail.gmail.com. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MK2-16v" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/mk2-16v. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/mk2-16v/CABrbKB%3DOi0aUvqDB-YAOSP9LFftdqvnBqVBaDTu6iVYLRKE60Q%40mail.gmail.com. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MK2-16v" group. 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