But Claude, we have only had internet poster auctions for a little over
10 years now -- and sniping programs for only about the past 7 years --
and gavelsnipe.com, which is the only sniper that works with Heritage,
has only been around since January, 2007 -- just the past 2 1/2 years.
Surely you were just as busy back before then as you are now... probably
even more so. How did you ever did you find time to acquire your massive
collection *before* internet auctions and sniper programs? It must have
been hell on you.
Wait... I thought if one has whole bunches of money that one can hire
someone to do the things one doesn't have time to do for oneself. But
perhaps I was misinformed.
But I'm not unsympathetic. I do see your point: 99% of the bidders on
poster auctions should be content to live with a less-than level playing
field and be denied the opportunity to trump the last bid to save you
and a few other wealthy, time-constrained folks some time.
I should have realized I was advocating something that might
inconvenience you a bit. How terribly rude of me. I will now cease with
insulting typing and go hang head in utter shame at sheer unthinking
audacity displayed by one's unworthy self.
-- JR
[email protected] wrote:
*JR*
*First of all the live auctions are normally much better material.*
*They also take place a few times a year (Heritage has 2 or 3 and
Everett has 2)*
*The auctions move very quickly and the auctioneer does about 100 to
120 posters per hour. *
*You can pick and choose what you want to bid on there or via
telephone, which is my normal bidding operation*
*Once the bidding starts you must make up you mind in seconds not 5
minutes and then 5 more.*
*I make time for these auctions because of the better material .*
*I do not have the time to sit at the computer and watch while the
bidding goes up, adds 5 minutes,etc. I don't know what you do for a
living but I work about 60 hours a week. I play racquetball 3 times a
week at a club for 2-3 hours on Sun, Tue, Thu. I go to the gym 3
other days a week and run for an hour. Friday is my day of rest. I
make more money per hour than most on those on MoPo make in a week and
they don't pay me that for sitting around playing with poster
auctions. If you Google me you will see who I am and why my time is
heavily scheduled.*
**
*I have a wife, 4 children and 8 grandchildren. These are more
important to me than sitting at the computer waiting for extended bids. *
**
*My work day starts at 6:30 am after 15 minutes looking at ebay. If I
see something I want, I immediately place a snipe bid and that is it
for the week on that poster on ebay.*
**
*I generally look at Bruce's auctions on Tuesday and Thursday nights
around* *10 to 10:30 and then go to bed.*
**
*I only placed one high bid recently on Bruce's auctions because I
loved that poster and haven't seen one in many years. (I won if you
are interested). Had I been able to snipe I believe it may have gone
for less but not much. *
**
*There are too many auctions on the internet every week for extended
bidding. I do believe one thing because I have given it some
thought. Most of the people who complain about sniping are those who
really do not bid a lot for posters. I'll bet an hour's wage that the
bulk of those who complain never bid as high as $100 for a poster.
Their mentality is that if they had only placed one more bid they
would have won. They have no clue about how high the snipe bid really
was.*
**
*Finally, sniping prevents the auction house from taking your bid
higher. Please don't misinterpret this to point a finger at Bruce or
Grey. I believe they do not do this and I have placed high bids on
both and I was not run up. However, the current state of the hobby
has created too much turmoil, doubt and finger pointing which can be
helped using sniping.*
**
*I said enough and Bruce will now answer me. We have a friendly
adversarial relationship on this subject and I will not budge. Maybe,
he will on his better auctions which are infrequent. This could be a
good compromise.*
**
*Claude Litton*
**
In a message dated 10/3/2009 4:01:06 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
[email protected] writes:
*Claude,*
*First of all, I'm not advocating eliminating sniper programs...
it is great that they keep one's maximum bid secret, even from the
auction house and it is great that they mean I can keep bidding
automatically as the auction is ending when I can't be at my
computer.*
*The only thing extended bidding times at Heritage would do would
be to prevent the behind the scenes, last micro-second ambush
where the other bidders don't have an opportunity to try to try to
outbid the last bid. Which is *exactly* how live floor auctions
work -- do you have a problem bidding in live floor auctions? They
*all* have "extended bidding time" where the guy holding the gavel
says "I now have $5,000... do I hear $5,200? No? $5,200 anyone?
Going once at $5,200... going twice.." etc. If you don't have a
problem with live auctions which have extended bidding times, why
should you be so adamant about internet auction having the same thing?
*
*Whether the other bidders can win if it happens to be you they
are bidding against is immaterial -- the other bidders should
still have the option to try.*
*And besides, if you keep your promise that you will never place a
high maximum on an extended time auction... wait... doesn't that
means that in those cases we actually do stand a chance of
winning, even against you (if you keep that promise)?
*
*-- JR*
Claude Litton wrote:
*What is the point of you seeing a bid in the last few seconds if
you cannot outbid me (as you stated). There isn't a single
poster that I cannot buy so if I want it I can bid with an
outrageous price and you cannot beat me. For example: If a
poster has a value around $4,000 to $5,000 based on rarity and
recent sales, what good does it do you if I place a snipe bid of
$10,000? You are tilting at windmills.*
**
*There was a poster I wanted a while ago with a value of $5,000
based on previous sales and similar titles by the same actor. I
placed a snipe bid of $15,000. So what does the knowledge of
being beaten every time you place an extended bid do you? You
can't win. There can only be one winner and these weekly
auctions have to end sometime. *
**
*The most important factor here is this. I will not under any
circumstances place a very high bid in an extended format so the
loser is the seller. I do not want anyone to know what I am
willing to pay for a poster. Sniping is the only way to go.*
**
*CJL*
In a message dated 9/28/2009 5:33:21 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
[email protected] writes:
Todd (and others opposed to 1 or 2 minute extended bidding
times),
This is an example where modern technology has corrupted our
cultural philosophy. Letting the sniper programs battle it
out in the last micro-seconds behind the scenes where no one
can see what is going on is just fine if you don't care about
the concept of public auctions being a level playing field
where everyone bidding has the opportunity to keep bidding
after a higher bid has trumped their own. But that is exactly
how things are done at live auctions. Why shouldn't it work
that way for internet auctions? Just because Ebay never did
it that way?
I *like* sniper programs and use them. I do agree that it is
a good thing if the auction house cannot see your maximum bid
-- no temptation, no potential conflict of interest and no
foul. That's one of the big positive aspects of sniping
programs. And, as you say, it's great that you don't have to
sit at the computer with your fingers glued to the mouse
counting down those last seconds.
But we all know that one's theoretical "maximum bid" is not
always writ in stone. Have you never adjusted your maximum
snipe bid as the auction was nearing its close and you saw
how the bidding was going and decided that maybe your
original maximum might not be quite enough? I certainly have.
If someone has enough money to place extremely high maximum
sniper bids on anything they want and so virtually guarantee
they will win 99% of what they bid on... well that's very
nice for them, isn't it? But most of us -- even those who do
use sniper programs like myself -- don't have that luxury and
we should be able to see what the last bid is and decide
(quickly) if we want to try to outbid or not. Fair is fair.
-- JR
Todd Spoor wrote:
To All,
I really don't see the point of extended bidding, if you put
in the MAXIMUM you want to spend in the first place, if you
get outbid in the last second, so what, you weren't going to
spend more than that anyways!!! Sniping is a great way to
enter a Maximum bid and NOT have to watch the auction
especially if it closes at an odd time or if you are at
work. I win 99% of every auction I bid because of sniping
plus the AUCTION HOUSE can not see my maximum bid!!!
Todd Spoor
-----Original Message-----
From: James Richard
Sent: Sep 28, 2009 4:05 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [MOPO] An odd incident on this past Sunday
Heritage Auction
Grey,
How is extended bidding a waste of time? If no last
second bid comes in, then the auction closes as
scheduled. If a last second bid does come in,
automatically extending the auction's end time by maybe
2 minutes gives other bidders who want the item a chance
to trump the last-second bid. Hardly a waste of their
time if it means they win and auction they otherwise
would have lost -- and both Heritage and the consigner
make more money.
Where's the downside?
I do think the implementation of extended bidding at
emovieposter.com is too broad. I think in that case that
if a bid comes in during the last 5 minutes the end time
is extended by 5 minutes -- since lots of people prefer
to place a bid in the last couple of minutes, parameters
like that *do* tend to waste people's time. To work more
efficiently, parameters should probably be 1 or 2
minutes. An extra 2 minutes isn't going to bother
someone -- not if they really want the poster -- and it
puts everyone on a level playing field whether they are
using gavelsnipe.com or not.
-- JR
Smith, Grey - 1367 wrote:
Hi, John.
Well, the email was supposed to go private but my mistake.
Yes, many snipe bid on the site now.
In fact, as you are aware, we end all items at 10PM CT
every Sunday evening, so many prefer not to have to sit
by the computer.
My belief is that the extended bidding platform is a
waste of our bidder's time, though one of our other
divisions does use it.
Grey
Visit the MoPo Mailing List Web Site at www.filmfan.com
___________________________________________________________________
How to UNSUBSCRIBE from the MoPo Mailing List
Send a message addressed to: [email protected]
In the BODY of your message type: SIGNOFF MOPO-L
The author of this message is solely responsible for its content.
Visit the MoPo Mailing List Web Site at www.filmfan.com
___________________________________________________________________
How to UNSUBSCRIBE from the MoPo Mailing List
Send a message addressed to: [email protected]
In the BODY of your message type: SIGNOFF MOPO-L
The author of this message is solely responsible for its content.
Visit the MoPo Mailing List Web Site at www.filmfan.com
___________________________________________________________________
How to UNSUBSCRIBE from the MoPo Mailing List
Send a message addressed to: [email protected]
In the BODY of your message type: SIGNOFF MOPO-L
The author of this message is solely responsible for its content.
Visit the MoPo Mailing List Web Site at www.filmfan.com
___________________________________________________________________
How to UNSUBSCRIBE from the MoPo Mailing List
Send a message addressed to: [email protected]
In the BODY of your message type: SIGNOFF MOPO-L
The author of this message is solely responsible for its content.
