Inserted Platt. (Fortunately Ant and Gav have put the original thread concerning the "convention" of the individual back on track.)
On 8/30/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Quoting ian glendinning <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > > > Spot on Arlo. > > > > Platt, the point you keep "ignoring" is that your ignorance is often > > the actual subject of correspondence, and therefore NOT an ad hominem > > attack on your doubtful arguments, but valid assertions about you. The > > fact that you keep ignoring this point is consistent with your > > ignorance, as I have also remarked. > > Yes, I know. It's been obvious for many moons that if I disagree with > you or Arlo, it's proof (valid) that I am ignorant. The astonishing arrogance > of such thinking is, of course, blindly ignored in your own ignorance. :-) [IG] If that were true, you'd have a point. Can you not distinguish between "ignoring" and "disagreeing" ? When did "valid assertion" become "proof" ? > > > And on your point - obviously words mean things, they have > > significance, but not since Wittgenstein has anyone (even anyone in > > the west, except you) thought that the relationships between the words > > and meanings were a matter of logic. They are largely matters of > > culture, as Arlo elaborates. > > So what culture do you inhabit? An illogical one? [IG] Several many and varied ones - one thing I do know about them is that there is more to them than logic (logic has it's uses but, the point you are still ignoring, extracting meaning from language is not one of them). > > > Here's a thought. If an "individual" is a convenient fiction, does > > that make Platt and "inconvenient fiction" ? > > The better question, since you are fictional, is "Does Ian exist? > > Platt > > > > > Ian > > > > On 8/30/07, Arlo Bensinger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > [Platt] > > > I wonder what the word for "individual" is in Chinese. > > > > > > [Arlo] > > > This "useful convention" (the "self") is a stable part (and result) > > > of collective activity. But for an interesting aside, consider this > > > from a Cornell study on self-concept, "Contrast of U.S./Chinese > > > memories shows impact of culture on 'self-concept'". > > > > > > "Americans often report lengthy, specific, emotionally elaborate > > > memories that focus on the self as a central character," said Qi > > > Wang, an assistant professor of human development at Cornell. > > > "Chinese tend to give brief accounts of general routine events that > > > center on collective activities and are often emotionally neutral. > > > These individual-focused vs. group-oriented styles characterize the > > > mainstream values in American and Chinese cultures, respectively." > > > > > > http://www.news.cornell.edu/Chronicle/01/6.28.01/memory-culture.html > > > > > > The short reporting of this study concludes as such. ""These findings > > > indicate that cultural differences in autobiographical memory are > > > apparently set by early preschool years and persist into adulthood. > > > They are formed both in the larger cultural context that defines the > > > meaning of the self and in the immediate family environment," Wang > > > concludes. "The self and autobiographical memory are intertwined not > > > only within an individual but also in the overarching cultural system."" > > > > > > -------------------------- > > > > > > "This fictitious "man" has many synonyms: "mankind," "people," "the > > > public," and even such pronouns as "I," "he," and "they." Our > > > language is so organized around them and they are so convenient to > > > use it is impossible to get rid of them. There is really no need to. > > > Like "substance" they can be used as long as it is remembered that > > > they're terms for collections of patterns and not some independent > > > primary reality of their own." (Pirsig, LILA) > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------- > This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ > Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
