[SA] Well, we both agree on this. We just have different solutions. Mine begins with ones' own self, yours with representatives to do it for you.
[Arlo] This is an incorrect distortion. There is a division of labor necessary for the continued functioning of the infrastructure we all enjoy. Let's start with those hiking trails, SA. Do you really think if sold them off to Exxon or Walmart they'd be there for you to enjoy? Or do you think they'd disappear, replaced either by exclusive private lands, cheap Disneyish "real forest" attractions, or mined for their resources? They are there because we, as public stewards, have a system in place where representatives of the public's interests ensure that they remain unspoiled and accessible by all. Would you feel safe if all our diplomatic efforts overseas were replaced with representatives of Standard Oil or any of the big pharmaceutical or defense companies? Would you think your interests are being represented? Would you think they'd work on behalf of what's best for the American people, or what's best for their own bottom line, their own wealth creation, their own power? And, before you say, this is the way things are, that's my point. They are this way because of we have accepted mediocrity, we simply do not care, and into that vacuum of apathy, clowns, buffoons and self-interested money hungry capistocrats have poured by the bucketful. I, too, think the solution begins in each and every person, it begins with people making Quality decisions, as Pirsig reminds us in ZMM. It begins with people "caring". You do what part in the overall process you can do, whether its help wayward youth, or teach languages, or nurse the sick, or build computers, or weld motorcycle frames. But, our eye always has to be on the larger picture as well, and that is on our civic and social responsibilities. If our government is corrupt, it is because we have let it become so, it is our fault. Not some "other" somewhere out there mucking up things for you. Those lands you enjoy are there because citizens, you and me, got together and recognized that there is more and greater value to a public stewardship over them. And that public stewardship will only succeed when citizens are involved and care. When they are not, that stewardship fails. [SA] See, this is the problem with people who invest in others to represent them. They begin to see that other people must do 'things' for them, and when somebody doesn't invest in their representational way, then they think those people are apathetic just because they don't follow them like good little sheep. [Arlo] The alternative to public stewardship is to allow people do not represent you to make these decisions that effect your life. You bet I invest in my public representatives to protect our national and state forests, keep our roadways functional and freely accessible, ensure that information is not the exclusive domain of the wealthy, ensure that we negotiate peaceful relations with our international neighbors, and of course to protect us from aggressive enemies, to secure our borders, and to provide an infrastructure of police, fire and EMT services that treat all citizens as equals. When someone's home is on fire, you bet I invest in public representatives to ensure that your fire department gets there, has the means to put it out. When there is an auto accident, you bet I invest in public representatives to ensure that local EMT services are fast, well-prepared, well-equipped, and unconcerned with anyone's "private wealth status". And here's the kicker, SA, everything I have been saying is that you should NOT follow your representatives like "sheep". You should actively and passionately become involved. The only "sheep" in the equation are the people who want to bury their heads in the sand and wait for other people to save them from a system that they themselves passively accept. [SA] You keep saying I'm not doing anything. [Arlo] No, I'm saying with regards to public stewardship, you are content to passively do nothing and wait for others to change a system you are apparently unhappy with. I am sure you do things, valuable things, in your private life. And that's great. But turning a blind-eye to responsible citizenship is what is giving us the deplorable mediocrity we have. But if you would be content to let Exxon and Walmart buy up and control our public lands, so that you didn't need to be bothered by the idea of having "representatives do something for you", than I think that's where our conversation hits a brick wall. [SA] From my perspective your saying I don't hit home runs for theYankees because I didn't try, but I don't play on that team Arlo. [Arlo] If you were a shareholder of the Yankees franchise, and complained about how poorly the team was playing, but said your solution was to not do anything and wait for the other shareholders to get better ball-players for the team, then I'd say you had an apt analogy. Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
