Thanks, both Dwai and Ham for your responses. Life has to be meaningful -- from this basic view values can be derived rationally and most importantly consciously. THis is also very controversial as meaning,( even when it is said life has NO meaning meanig is being ascribed) differs for different S/O combinations. It is very right to say that true meaning lies in experience -- of relations (among S/O entities) that are very dynamic. That brings us at the doorsteps of change nad chance because chance decides the experience. If we say that we decide, we are only limiting things...So luck(chance) being operational at one level and not operating at others seems contradictory, as differences/causess have to be explained, even level-wise. Hence the dilemma> Many regards -- VJS
> Date: Tue, 11 Mar 2008 15:01:21 -0400> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL > PROTECTED]> Subject: Re: [MD] The Beginning of it All> > > My apologies to > Dwai for misdirecting my comments to him on a question from > VJS.> [I'm > reposting that message for his attention.]> > On 3/10/08 Vishwajeet Daharan > wrote:> > The last lines intrigued me - if not in world of finite > experience,> > where should one look for that esthetic or enhancing > experience.> > And maybe desire in the world of finite is not so good but > desire> > for THAT..., so a redirecting or in psychological terms> > > sublimation is a better idea.> > I assume the lines you refer to are these > directed to Marsha:> > > I don't subscribe to the Buddhist idea that desire > is the root> > of all evil. Quite the contrary, what we desire expresses our> > > sense of value and is the driving force of human progress.> > Without > desire, human beings would be devoid of feelings or> > motivation. Unable to > discriminate between good and bad,> > mankind would have no morality, and > civilization would stagnate.> > If there is an undifferentiated aesthetic > continuum of Quality,> > it is not to be found in the mundane world of finite > experience.> > Yes, I believe this to be true. Human action follows choice, > and choice is> an expression of one's value sensibility. Hence, all voluntary > actions are> motivated by Value, and what we do in life as free agents > reflects those> values we choose to pursue for ourselves. When emotional > choices are> mediated by reason, behavior is made "moral" (in the collective > sense of> that word). Therefore, unless our actions are obligatory, or > imposed on us> by some external authority, we are driven by selfish values. > But since we> are also rational beings, most of us will temper our behavior > to some degree> by reason. That's why (borrowing from Ayn Rand's philosophy) > I came up with> the maxim "rational self-directed value".> > You ask where we > must look for "that esthetic or enhancing experience"> which transcends the > relational world. Where else, indeed, but in> experience itself?> > Human > beings are endowed with an exquisite sense of value, ranging from an> > appreciation of the arts, the beauty and order of nature, the dignity and> > intellectual perspective of man, and the insight that comes from> > understanding that each of us is an individualized microcosm of our absolute> > source. We can only experience reality finitely, as subjective beings> > negated (or divided) from the essential source. Because the locus of our> > existence is separated from this Essence, we are free and autonomous agents,> > capable of making our being in the world a reflection of our chosen values.> > > Human beings are the "choicemakers" of this world. By realizing that> > value-sensibility is our existential reality, we can shape the world as a> > rational system in which all mankind will be free to optimize their> > individual value-sensibilities without fear of imposing their wants on> > others. The potential for such an ideal world exists here in existence, but> > we must have both the wisdom and the will to implement it.> > Thanks for your > response, Dwai.> > Essentially yours,> Ham> > > Moq_Discuss mailing list> > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc.> > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org> Archives:> > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/> > http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ _________________________________________________________________ Tried the new MSN Messenger? It’s cool! Download now. http://messenger.msn.com/Download/Default.aspx?mkt=en-in Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
