I recall I must have scibbled "Exactly !" a hundred times in the margins of Garfield's MKK when I first read it Marsha.
With this renewed interest I am going to have to open it up again. All this "dependent arising" - "as if" - apparent causality, apparent subjects / objects, apparent logical connections between subjects / objects / causation, all spins out of this. The SOMist myth is well explained by MKK IMHO. Thanks. Ian On Thu, Aug 7, 2008 at 9:37 AM, MarshaV <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > This is from MKK: > > "What we are typically confronted with in nature is a vast network of > interdependent and continuous processes, and carving our particular > phenomenon for explanation depends more on our explanatory interests and > language than on joints nature presents to us." > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ian Glendinning" > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Thursday, August 07, 2008 10:15 AM > Subject: Re: [MD] the subjective > > >> Gav, David, >> >> Gav says >> subjects and objects exist only as abstractions from this stream >> >> David says >> ... objectivity [is] a view from nowhere, therefore always a fiction, >> but useful ... >> >> Exactly both of you ... the actual experience is always an immediate >> dynamic stream, the abstractions just things we can "pin down" whilst >> we talk about them using traditional SOMist language and logic. >> >> Talking of which ... hearing in colour anyone ? >> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/7545888.stm >> Ian >> >> On Tue, Aug 5, 2008 at 12:38 AM, gav <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >>> >>> with respect ham i think you are overcomplicating things. >>> >>> parsimony has something to it you know...at least according to that >>> ockham dude. >>> >>> 1. there is no 'before experience'; this would be a nonsense statement. >>> (immediate) experience is t=0. >>> >>> 2. immediate experience is dynamic, a process, a flux....a stream. there >>> are no objects or subjects in the stream. >>> >>> 3. subjects and objects exist only as abstractions from this stream. >>> >>> 4. this process of abstraction occurs at t>0 with respect to the part of >>> the stream focussed on. >>> >>> cheers >>> gav >>> >>> >>> Find a better answer, faster with the new Yahoo!7 Search. >>> www.yahoo7.com.au/search >>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>> Archives: >>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>> http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ >>> >> Moq_Discuss mailing list >> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >> Archives: >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >> http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ > Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
