Interesting M K. What do you mean here below for law is moral. M K > Arlo's "property" is an abstract extension of Nick's "natural rights". > > Logos and Bios are duelling for the hand of Ethos. A classical > moment brought to us by the Moq. > > > > > ________________________________ > From: Arlo Bensinger <[email protected]> > To: [email protected] > Sent: Tuesday, June 9, 2009 8:08:37 AM > Subject: Re: [MD] Coerce me? How? > > [Arlo previously] > Let me try again. What makes your land YOURS, Nick. Just because > you say it is? > > [Nick] > Yes. As simple as it sounds, that's the whole point and always has > been for centuries. > > [Arlo] > Oh, Nick. So close and yet so far. So its YOURS just because you > say it is. Let's say your neighbor says it is HIS? Who is right? > What legitimizes YOUR claim and makes his WRONG? C'mon, Nick, > you're close... you can do it. > > [Nick] > That's called stealing, but since you don't understand what > stealing is in the first place it's easy to see why you would > conclude this. > > [Arlo] > Why? You bought the land in a monetary transaction from me? Why > isn't it YOURS? So close, Nick, you can do it... > > [Nick] > But since you advocate government take-overs and stealing you would > repeat history. > > [Arlo] > Right. So its okay to benefit from stealing and murder, as long as > you didn't pull the trigger. But if someone tries to take what > you've acquired through murder and theft, that would be wrong. Got > it. Your NAP sounds mighty whacky, if this is what it preaches. > > [Nick] > Oh, so they didn't like stealing. They recognized property. Thank > you very much. > > [Arlo] > Ah, Nick, you keep coming so close, then falling back into your > haze. They didn't have a concept of "stealing". They didn't > recognize "property" in any manner similar to what you claim is > "natural". It was communal, tribal, things belonged to the tribe. > Their social agreements revolved around "need", not "mine". If you > needed that bow, you took it, used it and that was fine. "Land" > didn't belong to the tribe, the tribe belonged to the land, and > they defended it because of their spiritual history being part of > that land. It wasn't '"ownership", it was "being part of". This > keeps eluding you, but keep at it, you might get it one day... > > [Nick] > Read up on natural rights. I posted a good article. It will help > you understand. > > [Arlo] > I could read up on black helicopters and aliens under the ice cap > too, but that doesn't mean anything. Since you avoided my question, > I'll ask it again. Try to answer it Nick, you may learn something. > > Do animals have a "natural right" to property? They are part of the > natural world, aren't they? They exist as biological beings just > like we do, don't they? If no, then why do humans but not animals? > Again, since you need a clue, the words "social" and "intellectual" > are in the answer. If yes, then why do you keep stealing land from > the animals, Nick, give it back. "Rights" are intellectual > patterns. They come from "man", not the natural world. And, in > modern times, these intellectual patterns have formed the basis for > our civil governance, a governance we created to give legitimacy to > our claims (of property, for one). > > You are close, Nick, real close, keep at it... I have hope for you yet. > > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ > > > > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
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