Hi Bruce
On 22 Dec. u wrote:
> I think the line is blurred as to when intellectual pattern began, but
> feel that it began when people began teaching other people skills. I
> think several things came into play to form the intellectual level: 1)
> Language was developed 2) knowledge was recognized in the form of
> memory 3) Written Language developed
When the intellectual level began is dependent on how it is defined
and after years it has shifted from the initial mind-like (thinking) one to
the correct S/O, and if so its start (in the Western world) is described
as SOM's emergence in ZAMM.
If it started with people teaching each other skills it began with animals
and birds that obviously learn skills from each other. If language was
the intellectual hallmark it began deep down in the social level (I
recently heard that the Neanderthals "had language"). Knowledge
ditto, if merely "how to" it's social, after the Greeks it became
"objective knowledge" and that's the proper intellectual LEVEL. Written
language likewise.
Look to this from LILA to understand what the intellectual level is
about:
Third, there were moral codes that established the supremacy
of the intellectual order over the social order-democracy, trial
by jury, freedom of speech, freedom of the press.
The 4th. level has nothing to do with "thinking" or "mental activity" as
so many are hung up in, but about establishing supremacy over social
value and all these "freedoms" are based on an objective, skeptical
attitude towards social bigotry, social pre-judice, social superstition,
social god-explanations (religions included) ...etc.
> The intellectual level began when the social level realized that they
> could overcome the "memory barrier" of the biological level (death) by
> passing skills to other generations via language. The limitation of
> the biological level is that memory is only passed at via DNA. The
> need came through the social level to share survival skills to future
> generations. The first way of doing this was through spoken language,
> but the real innovation came when written word was created. For the
> first time there was a way to create lasting memory that social level
> could use that circumvented the biological level. I believe this was
> the beginning of the intellectual level.
All this makes the intellectual level an improved social level and that's
not MOQ's point, the upper level is a break with the parent level.
> As far as religions are concerned, there would be no religion if death
> did not exist. I think that the MoQ allows for religion, but I think
> that it clearly shows the division of religion and the "Church of
> Science" IMO however, MoQ opens the door for "religion" in the
> arguments around Quantum physics and in the whole concept of "Quality"
> as the driving force in everything. The problem that I see is
> everybody wants to use the same stale aruguments to prove something
> that is out of the realm of proof at this point. Interestingly,
> perhaps the first intellectual acheivement allowed the social level to
> circumvent death, but it is the social level is still attempting to
> overcome death via religion. To me, MoQ shows that every thing
> returns to patterns of energy...if not one pattern then another.
Religion are so many things. There is the infinitely old animism which
proclaims all nature to be "alive, this the mono-theist "semitic" religions
declare paganism. Then there are the more recent yet terribly old
mythologies - like the Greek and Norse - with one god for each
aspects of existence. This the said mono-theist religions declare even
worse heathendom. Then the religions themselves declare each other
infidelity. All this belongs to the social realm what the intellectual tries
to overcome with its detached, scientific, objective attitude. It is as
skeptical to animism as it is to mono-theism. The MOQ - when/if
realized - will be a body of wisdom, more like a Western Buddhism.
Bodvar
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