Ron, I understand 'ultimate', as representing emptiness, being preferred over 'absolute' because 'absolute' might suggest something that exists in and of itself,independently. Nothing is independent in the Madhayamika system, even emptiness.
Ron, I also think that equating relativism with 'Absolute relativism' is a red herring. That patterns are relative doesn't equate to 'all is equal', and doesn't prevent judgements based on what is useful. Concerning relative truths (sq), what is bad is that which causes suffering and what is good is that which removes suffering. For me it isn't so complicated. Marsha On Mar 4, 2010, at 8:15 AM, X Acto wrote: > > > > Marsha, > > I think it is proper to talk of Ultimate Truth rather than the Absolute, but, > and I > could be misunderstanding, Ultimate Truth is not separate from conventional > truths. Kind of like sq and DQ are interdependent. > > Ron: > Nagarjuna would agree, to speak of a concept, it must be understood in terms > of related > concepts, a hanging together of ideas..when we use terms like ultimate and > absolute > we mean the entirety of things, the whole of it. Kant argued if the > conception of > such a thing is even possible, Nietzsche criticized Hegel for it..Aristotle > charges Parmenides, > Buddha mocks the idea of it. > > As it applies to both the one and the many, unity and plurality, monism and > relativism. > > But they are criticizing how that belief is formed, Aristotle makes a point > similar > to Pirsig and James in that Absolute relativism neglects the good. > > > > > > > > > > > On Mar 4, 2010, at 12:20 AM, John Carl wrote: > >> On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 10:18 AM, X Acto <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> >>> I believe Pirsig would agree with W. James and Nagarjuna. >> >> >> >> As would Royce and me, Ron. Our case for an absolute is also the middle way >> - it's not the only thing there is, but neither is it non-existent. And as >> an existant, it pulls that moral compass toward better and better analogy. >> >> >> >> John >> >> > > > > ___ > > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html > > > > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html ___ Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
