Hi Andre, I was implying such rhetoric was "interpersonal", I wasn't suggesting I was your ( or anyone's) personal target. You got my point anyway.
BTW, we seem to pretty much agree on what constitutes respect for each others arguments and agendas. Listening / understanding and linking / relating, etc. These are some basic forum rules I've used elsewhere (not specific to MoQ) : QUOTE Rules of Engagement Rule #1 RESPECT – Understand & Question before Disagree & Criticize. Critical debate is essential to our agenda and anyone voicing direct disagreement with or criticism of the arguments of another must be seen to have understood, or sincerely attempted to understand, the others’ argument and to have related their counter argument to it. Rule #2 RESPECT – No “Ad Hominem” attacks on the Individual. Absolute no-no. Anyone having trouble with an individual should resolve with that individual, and involve moderator(s) in absolute confidence if mediation or moderation is considered necessary. Rule #3 RESPECT – Duty of Care when using Rhetoric or Irony. OK, but life (mine and yours) would be boring and sterile if we politely agreed with each other. So lively, critical, robust, intelligent debate is positively encouraged. What will not be tolerated is any perceived intent to circumvent Rules #1 & #2 under cover of rhetoric or irony. UNQUOTE But I'm OK with minimum change - simply reconstituting MF say - but the point is there are rules and moderation is required to be active. Applying and moderating the rules is undoubtedly difficult in our situation where DQ and direct experience are fundamental to our agenda, but the rules are still necessary to maintain a functioning balance of workable patterns. Ian On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 5:29 PM, Andre Broersen <[email protected]> wrote: > Ian to Andre: > > Yes, and everything else (YouTube included, even FaceBook) is the > physio/bio/socio/intellectual cultural context for understanding and > living it. > > Andre: > Agree Ian, and then I will also expect that anyone who makes a reference to > these, or, for that matter reels off long/short quotes about something they > have read, makes a specific statement of how it relates to the MOQ which is > discussed here. > > I find it interesting that you add the 'living it' at the end of your > sentence. Assuming for a minute that what you mean by this is 'experiencing > it' it has the tendency to blur some distinctions which are crucial to keep > in mind when discussing Pirsig's MOQ. Marsha is an easy example to use in > this context as she is superimposing this 'living it' onto the MOQ and > thereby blurring, for example the distinction between DQ and sq. For Marsha > these are the same (correct me if I am wrong Marsha). Bodvar made a similar > assertion in this respect by suggesting that Pirsig's MOQ IS experience > which led his his non-acceptance of Pirsig's assertion that the MOQ is a > static intellectual pattern of value. > > It makes discussion of the MOQ (as a static intellectual pattern of value) > almost impossible as for ex. Marsha's responses (dismissals,evasions) make > clear. > > I may be off track here and am interested in your observations to the > contrary(if you hold any). > > Ian: > People need to stop casting aspersions about the "some", the > "brigade", the "old guard", the "fits", the "misfits", and if they > have a specific issue, name specific names and statements. Show some > trust and respect in other words. > > Andre: > Not sure if you are implying that I show distrust or disrespect Ian. If so, > I apologize (and note the start of your sentence with 'people'.) I did not > specify anyone in particular because dmb mentioned some specific persons in > a previous post and I wanted to avoid repetition. I also made clear (I hope) > that I do not enjoy the use of these labels. In this sense I am sad to note > that, over the past few months, a notion of 'us' and 'them' has crept in > which doesn't add any sense of trust or respect. > Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
