Hi David, Pirsig spends a long time on Art / Rta / Crafts etc ... so you can't reduce it to a single either or. There is no "it". That would be reductionist.
Is art DQ or isn't it ? (As I said already, art is full of both kinds of patterns - but the essential experience that distinguish the artistic from non-artistic is clearly DQ.) "dynamic" is clearly not the same as "Dynamic Quality" - one is natural language one is an undefined split in some undefinable metaphysical monad - sq is the defined part. I'm not the one trying to define the undefinable. I live the undefinable. Ian On Sat, Apr 2, 2011 at 2:10 AM, David Harding <[email protected]> wrote: > Ian, Mark, et al. > > dynamic or Dynamic Quality? > > What's the difference? > > Are they the same thing? > > If they are, then aren't we all defining the undefinable when we say > something, such as Ian does with music below, is dynamic? > > If the MOQ really is a way to live ones life. Shouldn't we be able to say > then, what is and is not Dynamic Quality? If the MOQ really is good then > shouldn't we be able to categorise something in either of the two boxes of > the first division of the MOQ? I'm seeing a lot of people getting stuck on > this point and I think the blame can be laid on the use of this term > 'dynamic' which avoids the issue entirely. > > 'dynamic' muddies things where the first division of the MOQ brings clarity. > > So that said. Ian, is art Dynamic Quality or static quality? > > > > On 31/03/2011, at 10:32 PM, Ian Glendinning wrote: > >> Ha, David, >> >> Attending (participating in) a musical event does not require any >> lingusitic or intellectual conceptualization of the experience - so >> you get a good dose of the dynamic. (Of course there are plenty of >> patterns involved in the music and the concert ritual itself, but only >> if you analyse them - you can feel the quality without doing that.) >> >> The source of many previous discussions on MD. You used the extreme >> sports "buzz" example and others as things beyond our discourse - I >> was just reinforcing your point. >> >> (The only reason I picked on Hawkwind and VdGG with a ;-) was knowing >> Horse is a fan and had experienced the latter only the day before - >> but you could substitute whatever artistic / cultural participation >> event that turns you on.) >> >> Ian >> >> On Thu, Mar 31, 2011 at 12:18 PM, David Harding <[email protected]> >> wrote: >>> Hi Ian, >>> >>> I'll bite. What does this have to do with the first division of the MOQ? >>> Is a Hawkwind or Van derGraaf Generator gig static quality or Dynamic >>> Quality? >>> >>> >>> On 30/03/2011, at 6:48 PM, Ian Glendinning wrote: >>> >>>> Hi David (H) >>>> >>>> You summarised your impression of Mark's take thus: >>>> >>>> "If everything is static quality", you seem to say.. "then that >>>> appears to be a very sad existence indeed." >>>> >>>> (You go on to point out lots of non-static things in real life ...) >>>> >>>> Mark's take hinges on the "everything" in the first clause being - >>>> "everything that we can objectivise and discuss in language in a >>>> metaphysics discussion forum (or anywhere else)". That would indeed be >>>> a very sad existence, but of course life, the universe and everything >>>> is a lot more than that, as you point out. >>>> >>>> As you perceive it's a source of frustration or sometimes confusion >>>> for many on MD .... that we can only ever skirt around reality ... but >>>> that is the reality of any discourse .... a reason why we need to meet >>>> in the flesh at Hawkwind or Van derGraaf Generator gigs ;-) >>>> >>>> Metaphysics discusses meta-life and meta-reality, it's not real-life >>>> itself. >>>> >>>> Ian >>>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>>> Archives: >>>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >>> >>> Moq_Discuss mailing list >>> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >>> Archives: >>> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >>> http://moq.org/md/archives.html >>> >> Moq_Discuss mailing list >> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >> Archives: >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >> http://moq.org/md/archives.html > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html > Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
