Steve to Dan: (1) ...to exactly what extent IS that? Isn't THAT the question we need to know about freedom? Everyone knows that our behaviors are constrained to some extent, but how far does that go?
(2) How do we come to know the difference (if we ever do) between "being controlled by" static patterns and "following" DQ? (3) Why are static patterns thought of as "controlling" our behavior while DQ is thought of as being "followed"? Andre: What I have missed, in a possible answer/finger pointing to, in this discussion is the story of Lila as it is told by Pirsig in LILA. Why did Pirsig give her that surname and how did she blew it? He says: "Biologically she's fine, socially she's pretty far down the scale, [as an intellectual] she's nowhere. But Dynamically...Ah! That's the one to watch. There is something ferociously Dynamic going on with her.( Can this be regarded as her 'will to be free?') All that aggression, that tough talk, those strange bewildered blue eyes".(LILA, p 165) Lila is clearly not happy with her situation. She finds herself, like the amoeba, in a low quality environment. "Does she have Quality? Biologically she does, socially she doesn't" And she is determined to do something about that. She is following DQ in search of acceptance, status, security, comfort... Richard Rigel! You name it. All social patterns of value. That is all she sees from her vantage point. And this is the reason she 'blew it'. Pirsig, from the AHP tapes: "She wasn't ready to emerge from her static patterns. She was still locked into them. She still longed for this man she slept with in childhood, immorally. She was still longing for her child. She still longed for social acceptance. For Lila, Quality was acceptance by society. And so she wasn't ready to keep on going. And she went back to Rigel". So it appears as well that to follow Dynamic Quality means to keep on going. To not be constrained by biological patterns, nor social patterns nor intellectual patterns. "the MOQ...denies any existence of a "self" that is independent of inorganic, biological, social or intellectual patterns. There is no "self" that contains these patterns. These patterns contain the self. This denial agrees with both religious mysticism and scientific knowledge. In Zen, there is reference to "big self" and "small" self. Small self is the patterns. Big self is Dynamic Quality." (Annotn. 29) It seems to me that, what Pirsig calls "follow Dynamic Quality" he means following a path towards enlightenment. But, as Anthony observes in his PhD (pp44-5)"...one should not be seeking to arrive at just recognizing Dynamic Quality but to a more profound understanding: 'The teaching of emptiness is actually an affirmation of the dynamic interconnectedness of all things'...The treatment of Quality through ZMM (its formlessness) and LILA (its forms) can, when taken together, be read as reflecting the circle of enlightenment...To use Pirsig's terminology, enlightenment as such entails an awareness of Dynamic Quality through static quality patterns". Clearly Lila Blewitt has a way to go yet. Hope this helps somewhat. Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
