Hi Ron, I wondered too about the sentence's introduction as "Nietzsche says" and proves to be a bait and switch to what dmb says. Oh well. What can you expect.
Marsha On Oct 12, 2012, at 8:06 AM, X Acto wrote: > Dave, > What can you expect from a troll. Trolling just ruins the entire motivating > factor of being on a philosophy forum. I know I need a break from it. > It's depressing. > -Ron > > > ________________________________ > From: david buchanan <[email protected]> > To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> > Sent: Wednesday, October 10, 2012 11:11 AM > Subject: Re: [MD] The Art of Philosophy > > > Marsha keeps asking the same question: > > My interest is in one particular sentence. Regardless of the context of your > paragraph and without your explanations, my request is for the text that > represents the second half of the above sentence 'because virtue and > knowledge are necessarily connected such that “Truth” is the highest good.' > I am interested in what Nietzsche wrote. My interest is in the ACTUAL TEXT > from which you extracted this paraphrasing. > > > dmb says: > Sigh. How can I make it any clearer? It was always clear. As I originally > constructed it, the "paraphrased" section is immediately preceded AND > followed by quotes from Nietzsche. I'm paraphrasing that quoted text from The > Birth of Tragedy. It's right there in front of you and always was. LOOK! > > Nietzsche says, the “virtuous hero must henceforth be a dialectician” > > dmb says, because virtue and knowledge are necessarily connected such that > “Truth” is the highest good. > > Nietzsche says, “Socrates and his successors,.. have considered all moral and > sentimental accomplishments ...to be ultimately derived from the dialectic of > knowledge,..” > > So now you're persisting with the question simply because you can't recognize > that these three lines all say the same thing, are different ways to > articulate the same meaning. If you understood that meaning, then you would > NOT be asking a question that never needed to be asked in the first place. > The question is based on nothing except your own inability to derive meaning > from the written word. > > Thanks for wasting everyone's time, yet again. I'm done. Don't be surprised > if I just go back to ignoring your nonsense. > > > >>> dmb said: >>> >>> If you believe Plato, then the answer is “yes”. If all of philosophy is a >>> footnote to Plato, then the artists have been subordinated to the >>> philosophers for about 25 centuries. According to Plato’s Republic, >>> especially the last section, the artists present a danger to society and to >>> your soul. Two of my favorite thinkers disagree with Plato and Socrates on >>> this point. Friedrich Nietzsche and Robert Pirsig both make a case that >>> there is something terribly wrong with this Platonic legacy. In one of >>> Nietzsche’s earliest works, The Birth of Tragedy, he asks us to consider >>> the consequences of the Socratic idea that virtue is knowledge, that all >>> sins arise from ignorance, and only the virtuous are happy. As a >>> consequence, Nietzsche says, the “virtuous hero must henceforth be a >>> dialectician” because virtue and knowledge are necessarily connected such >>> that “Truth” is the highest good. >>> >>> Mayrsha asked about the last sentence: >>> Read the sentence. It's a statement of what Nietzsche SAYS, and WHY he >>> says it. If Nietzsche ever stated that any kind of truth "is the highest >>> good" then I would like to read the original text that supports this >>> paraphrasing. You did not write "Nietzsche ironically says", nor did you >>> present the WHY (because) as your (dmb's) conclusion. So again, if this >>> second half of the sentence was paraphrasing where is the original text. >>> If not who's conclusion is it? ...I am just requesting the original text >>> (not book) where you've paraphrase "because virtue and knowledge are >>> necessarily connected such that “Truth” is the highest good." >>> >>> dmb says: >>> Oh, now I see what you're asking. Your question is predicated upon a >>> misreading or misunderstanding. As you read it, Nietzsche is advocating the >>> Platonic legacy rather than attacking it and complaining. Even though I say >>> explicitly that Nietzsche is making a case "that there is something >>> terribly wrong with the Platonic legacy" and I say explicitly that "the >>> consequences of the Socratic idea that virtue is knowledge", you've somehow >>> managed to confuse Plato view with Nietzsche's. >>> >>> Nietzsche and Pirsig are both OPPOSED to the idea that "Truth is the >>> highest good". Nietzsche is OPPOSED to the idea that, as he puts it, "the >>> virtuous hero must henceforth be a dialectician". It is Socrates, not >>> Nietzsche, who thinks the dialectic is "the highest exercise of man’s >>> powers, nature’s most admirable gift" such that all moral accomplishments, >>> noble deeds, and heroism is "ultimately derived from the dialectic of >>> knowledge". This is Nietzsche describing the PROBLEM, not his own position. >>> >>> The sentence you're asking about begins with the phrase, "as a consequence" >>> and that phrase is being used to connect with the previous sentence, which >>> says that Nietzsche is asking us "to consider the consequences of the >>> Socratic idea that virtue is knowledge". Even further, the sentence you're >>> asking about is followed immediately by a block quote from Nietzsche >>> wherein he twice names Socrates as the culprit! >>> >>> snip... >>> >> >> >> >> >> >> ___ >> >> >> Moq_Discuss mailing list >> Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org >> Archives: >> http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ >> http://moq.org/md/archives.html > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org/md/archives.html ___ Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
