dmb,
On Feb 4, 2013, at 1:23 PM, david buchanan wrote: > > Marsha wrote to X-man and dmb: > > > Here's my definition of the self: the “self” is a flow of ever-changing, > conditionally co-dependent and impermanent static patterns value in the > infinite field of Dynamic Quality. > > > > dmb says: > As I've pointed out many times, your definition of the self is contradictory. > Obviously, if the self "flows" and is "ever-changing" then it can not also be > a "static" pattern. Those are contradictory terms and so your definition is > nonsense. Can't you think of a way to say it that doesn't contradict standard > definitions or violate basic logic? > Words like "flowing" and "ever-changing" can rightly be used to describe the > "Dynamic", but not the "static" or the "patterned". Since "static" and > "Dynamic" are such central terms in the MOQ, your contradictory definition is > especially egregious. > > egregious |iˈgrējəs|adjective1 outstandingly bad; shocking : Marsha: And I pointed out many times, it is not anti-intellectual or a contradiction to understand that patterns may maintain a static, stable identity at the same time as they and their context are undergoing constant change. Marsha adds: Think of the Ship of Theseus, or a parade (Hume) where everyone drops out but is replaced so that the parade is maintained, or the body with its cells constantly being replaced... ------------- Or to quote the brilliant Dr. McWatt: "It’s fairly obvious from reading Pirsig’s texts that SOM is perceived by him as an example of ignorant thinking. Briefly, this is due to such systems ignoring the reality of Dynamic Quality. Why this is particularly ignorant is explained by the ‘Three Aspects’ of the Cittamatra school of Mahayana Buddhism. Williams (1988, p.83) states that the First Aspect refers to the falsifying activity of language which implies independent and permanent existence to things. As Hagen -202- (1997, p.30) notes, one of the most fundamental truths noted by the Buddha is that all aspects of our experience are in constant flux and change. According to the Buddha, when a person ignores this truth they subject themselves to dukkha." -202- Pirsig (1998b) notes that Hagen‘s text Buddhism: Plain & Simple ‘…shows the similarities, between the MOQ and Zen Buddhism more clearly than any other I have seen.’ " (McWatts, MoQ Textbook) Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
