Hi Gav, The key word in your first para is "when" (I might say "if").
Everything else hangs from that ... I wouldn't argue with the utopian view (at all) ... it's just the "how" do we expect to get there. Once there, it could indeed be that simple ... However, until when and if we get there, I still can't see the "nil governance" option being practical, or any significant chance of getting there. Part of governance is surely to preserve the freedoms we value, from those who don't. So far we seem to agree the right kind of education is at least part of it. (80% of it I'd say - education, education, education - hence my support for the "friends of wisdom" campaign.) Anyway ... Bye for now. Ian On 7/18/07, gav <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > hey guys, > thanks for the input. > it is quite simple i think ian, what need is there of > 'governance', or 'counter-evolutionary protective > measures', when communication is perfect and everyone > desires the same for themselves as for everyone else: > ie freedom and happiness. > > the only need i can see for explicit guidance is in > schooling. maybe this is where the governance is. at > school the individual is becoming whole, through > education. i don't think this 'education' will bear > much similarity to what goes by that name today > though. > > aldous huxley's final utopic novel, island, has a lot > on ideal schooling in it. ideal everythihng i suppose. > as a graduation ceremony (which is an initiation) the > students undergo a ritual where they all take a sacred > mushroom brew and go rock climbing together. this puts > each person's life in the hands of another (total > trust), and forces each to confront their own > mortality (essential to any initiation). afterwards, > still trippin, the students are ceremonially debriefed > and farewelled in a poignant process that completes > the transformation of the individual from child to > adult. > > at the moment society rules. it rules through law and > force and its power is not understood or accepted by > most adults (eg who believes smokin pot should be > illegal, or that you need to wait til 21 to drink?). > this breeds fragmentation, alienation. > when society is transformed it will become a living > matrix - rather than law we will return to lore. > rather than explicit compulsion we will have implicit > awareness. > > > > --- Heather Perella <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > [Ian] > > > One large or many small communities, I can't see > > literall "nil > > > governance" ever working. I really think we're > > talking about agreeing > the minimum necessary > > lightest-touch governance... it beomes a > > > definitional matter of the word "governance". > > > > > > Yeah, I've posted enough today. I would like > > to > > leave on a more dynamic intellectual note, so... I'm > > glad you pin-down this 'governance', and brought > > that > > back up. I agree. It does depend on what kind of > > governance we mean. As the settlers moved west > > across > > the Northern American continent, chiefs were picked > > out by these settlers. They talked with those that > > talked back. Treaties were signed by some that > > really > > did not speak for the whole population. So, even if > > we pick out what governance means, as you asked gav, > > the strategies of the how's and what's, the voice of > > the people, will depend not only on the people, but > > on > > those in different populations toying with their own > > agendas, as well. > > > > SA > > > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________Ready > > for the edge of your seat? > > Check out tonight's top picks on Yahoo! TV. > > http://tv.yahoo.com/ > > moq_discuss mailing list > > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > > > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > > Archives: > > > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > > http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ > > > > > > > ____________________________________________________________________________________ > Yahoo!7 Mail has just got even bigger and better with unlimited storage on > all webmail accounts. > http://au.docs.yahoo.com/mail/unlimitedstorage.html > > > > moq_discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ > moq_discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
