I agree, a Gantt chart will not work for everyone, but neither does Agile. I think the trick is to have many tools in your tool box, and use the best one for the job. Having been in both worlds, some things in Software project management don't translate well into Capital Projects Management.
The other thing I wanted to point out that yes at the start of a project you do not know everything for sure, and lots of things are relative, the ppl at the bean counter side of the table want an absolute estimate, with a certain margin of error/risk. I like the burn down concept I can see its value, especially at a stage of the project where we have a punch list. On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 11:12 AM, Mark Levison <[email protected]>wrote: > > > On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 1:01 PM, XO <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Hmm I can do the same with setting up a baseline Gantt and running a Pert >> Analysis. As I get closer to the end of the project I get more accurate. > > > Fair enough, but I will continue to claim that if your estimates are > absolute and not relative then their accuracy is limited. > > Also I think you will spend more building a Gantt chart (especially for a > team), with load balancing and all that than you will if you do simple > burndowns. > > You have to do what you think will work best for you, clearly I don't think > Gantt charts will work best for anyone. > > BTW Thanks for the thinking on this - you've just forced me to a write this > up as Cutter Email Advisory :-) One more thing on my todo list. > > Cheers > Mark > > >> >> On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 10:47 AM, Mark Levison < >> [email protected]> wrote: >> >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 12:25 PM, James Murphy <[email protected]>wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> >>>> 2009/3/13 Mark Levison [email protected] >>>> >>>>> >>>>> It boils down to the question - do you think that humans are good at >>>>> absolute estimation? My research says were not. You may believe >>>>> differently. >>>>> >>>> But the question arises why do you feel that a gantt chart represents >>>> something that is cast in stone and immutable? If you're talking about >>>> software development then agile makes sense for all kinds of reasons and >>>> the >>>> kind of dynamic and flexible scheduling you've got works - in fact is >>>> necessary because the goalposts are often being moved on you. But in other >>>> kinds of project whilst there is still a need for flexibility and >>>> adaptability in how one progresses toward a goal the objectives and the >>>> tasks to be complete can be far more clearly defined and at least some >>>> elements can be tightly and accurately estimated (subject of course to the >>>> required preconditions being met). >>>> >>>> For any methodology being able to get a picture of where you are now is >>>> useful... for any useful methodology a realisation that things may change >>>> is >>>> a necessity (-: >>>> >>> >>> I understand the point but my thesis is that a Gantt chart does tell you >>> what you think it does. Since I believe that abolute estimates are a false >>> promise then I think that Gantt charts are just a way of fooling yourself. >>> The only way people normally make these work is by adding lots of padding >>> etc. >>> >>> Attached is a burndown chart with Uncertainty cones drawn in. Note in >>> this case their hand drawn but it gives you an idea. At the start of a year >>> long project we can tell you what quarter we will finish in. Half way though >>> we'll have the month nailed, .... >>> >>> Anything else and either you've padded the plan a lot or your making a >>> promise that you can't prove. >>> >>> Cheers >>> Mark >>> >>> Blog: http://www.notesfromatooluser.com/ >>> Recent Entries: Agile/Scrum Smells: >>> http://www.notesfromatooluser.com/2008/06/agilescrum-smells.html >>> Agile Games for Making Retrospectives Interesting: >>> http://www.notesfromatooluser.com/2008/10/agile-games-for-making-retrospectives-interesting.html >>> >>> > > > -- > Cheers > Mark Levison > > Blog: http://www.notesfromatooluser.com/ > Recent Entries: Agile/Scrum Smells: > http://www.notesfromatooluser.com/2008/06/agilescrum-smells.html > Agile Games for Making Retrospectives Interesting: > http://www.notesfromatooluser.com/2008/10/agile-games-for-making-retrospectives-interesting.html > > > > --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MyLifeOrganized" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/myLifeOrganized?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
