Hi Ron,
> When I want to manually sort, I just start dragging-and-dropping to my
heart's content. MLO automatically goes into Manual Sort mode just by
dragging-and-dropping. I kind of like that from a UI perspective, and
not having to check another box in order to do so.
I agree! I also like the way it is. There's no reason to change that at all.
Dragging and dropping puts you automatically in manual mode, no need to
check anything. Here's the way I see it:
1. User drags and drops a task.
2. list goes into manual mode. I want to be able to see that that list is
now manually sorted. Some sort of visual cue somewhere --- a checkbox, the
word "(manual)" added to the views name, a depressed button. Something. My
idea is a checkbox next to "Auto Update", right above the list. It can be
discrete, but it must be visible, so I know my real priorities are
overriden.
Optionally, that same visual cue could have the second function of being
used to start manual mode --- that would be a way for users that don't know
about drag and drop to discover the feature. That's why I suggest a small
button or checkbox (so it's a visual cue and functional at the same time).
Just like the "Action Filter" button (first one in filter pane): it both
informs and is functional.
> If I want to go back to that automatic sorting, I just Select Sort,
Computer-Score, descending.
Sure, that works, and even being simple, it forces me to remember decisions
I made when I was designing the view. I also work with many views ("will
do", "should do" and "can do") and it's not that easy to remember what are
the rules for each one. Also, without the visual cues, I don't have an easy
way to know which are now in manual or automatic mode.
> If your automatic sorting is more
complicated than mine, just create a copy of your Will-Do view (call
it Will-Do Manual), and sort manually in the copy of your Will-Do
view.
That of course works, but it's still cumbersome IMO (specially when you're
dealing with multiple lists). Continuing my usage scenario, after I play
with manual mode and want to go back to automatic, I would just uncheck the
checkbox. MLO could warn me "You're about to lose all your custom
positionins. Are you sure?" (with "remember setting" checkbox). List is
reset back to automatic. If I want to play with it again, I just start
dragging and dropping again.
I am also against visual clutter, but I believe the visual cue is important
as well as the easy "reset back". For me, a checkbox is a small price to pay
for that. I believe sorting is an MLO biggie, and the UI must be clear about
what's going on.
Best,
Luciano
http://litemind.com
On Thu, Jan 28, 2010 at 2:52 PM, Ron Stockfleth <[email protected]>wrote:
> Hi Luciano,
>
> I think I am already doing something very similar to your usage
> scenario, but without the added check box for Manual Sorting.
>
> When I want to manually sort, I just start dragging-and-dropping to my
> heart's content. MLO automatically goes into Manual Sort mode just by
> dragging-and-dropping. I kind of like that from a UI perspective, and
> not having to check another box in order to do so.
>
> My "automatic" sorting for the view is Computer-Score, descending. If
> I want to go back to that automatic sorting, I just Select Sort,
> Computer-Score, descending. Simple! If your automatic sorting is more
> complicated than mine, just create a copy of your Will-Do view (call
> it Will-Do Manual), and sort manually in the copy of your Will-Do
> view. If you want to go back to your automatic sorting, just go back
> to your original Will-Do view. I think the functionality for what you
> want to do is already built in.
>
> As far as Visual cues for sorting, I simply select the Sort button in
> any view and all the sorting criteria is displayed. Again from a UI
> perspective, I kind of like these particular "visual" cues hidden, but
> only one click away, as I seldom need the sorting criteria on full
> display for my views.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Ron
>
> On Jan 27, 2:40 pm, Luciano Passuello <[email protected]> wrote:
> > Hi Andrey, thanks for this long-waited release -- I'm excited!
> >
> > I *wholeheartedly agree* with Chuck here.
> >
> > Let me describe my scenario of usage: The way I work is that I have a
> "will
> > do" list for the day, every day (a complex query: tasks due that day,
> plus
> > taks with a particular flag, grouped, and so on).
> > The scenario I want to use manual sorting is taking the
> automatically-sorted
> > view and re-sorting it on-the-fly as the day progresses. At some point, I
> > want the view to behave with automatic sorting again, so I can see what
> the
> > algorithm is suggesting for me.
> >
> > Just the way Chuck describes, I also expect a higher-level checkbox or
> > button "Manual Sorting" that I can simply uncheck (or depress, if a
> button)
> > and have the automatic sorting back just the way it was configured
> before.
> > (Also, I don't need the manual ordering to be preserved between
> > checking/unchecking of the checkbox)
> >
> > That pressed button (or checkbox), as well as the disabling of the
> sorting
> > controls would also serve as a visual cue in the UI that manual sorting
> is
> > in place and that any settings in place are currently overriden. (I
> couldn't
> > find any visual cue of manual sorting in the UI, and I believe it's
> > important to have one).
> >
> > That's it for first impressions, but I believe this is really important!
> > Let's keep testing!
> >
> > All the best,
> > Luciano.http://litemind.com
> >
> > On Wed, Jan 27, 2010 at 12:22 PM, chuckdevee <[email protected]> wrote:
> > > Thanks Andrey.. very nice feature this but it's a shame that moving to
> > > manual sorting overwrites the automatic sorting preferences by
> > > changing the first sorting option to manual. This means that there
> > > isn't a quick way of moving back to the previous automatic method of
> > > sorting for the relevant list. So if I switch back from manual to
> > > automatic, I have to try to remember what the first sort option was
> > > and wether it was ascending or descending.
> >
> > > I'd prefer it if manual sorting stood apart from automtic sorting
> > > options. Perhaps if it was an option that appeared in a tickbox above
> > > the other sorting options, perhaps causing them to be greyed out when
> > > selected.
> >
> > > If this was the case, then I could for one day, quickly over-ride an
> > > automatic sorting method, manually order the tasks in that list, then
> > > at some future time switch back to the previous stored automatic
> > > sorting preferences with the click of a button.
> >
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