Good morning - I like this discussion. The example of a reference interview is a good one. Sometimes I don't even know the question that needs to be asked. I look forward to attending this session Tuesday at the conference and learning how to have positive input in correcting problems.
Diane Disbro Branch Manager/Circulation Coordinator Union Branch Scenic Regional Library 308 Hawthorne Drive Union, MO 63084 (636) 583-3224 ddis...@scenicregional.org On Fri, Mar 30, 2018 at 10:26 AM, scott.tho...@sparkpa.org < scott.tho...@sparkpa.org> wrote: > Hi Kathy, > > Your points about “positive advocacy” are well-stated and well-taken, > but advocacy is what we are doing with Congress as we try to get IMLS money > restored for FY2019. We who live in the non-developer neighborhood of the > Evergreen community have more power than that, and, yes, it does involve > sponsoring development or bug-fixing projects. > > I also agree on the need for very good communication between those of > us who want a feature, but are not developers, and those who have the > skills to do the work. It is almost like I’m the patron and the developer > is the reference librarian, and I am probably in need of a good reference > interview. Regarding Holdings View, we can describe how we want it to work. > (One of our libraries provided excellent screen shots.) Do I share that > here or LP both? Regarding IRC, I am not shy about my opinions on that. I > have to use it for EOB meetings, but find it to be arcane to the > uninitiated. Also, it is simply not the way people in libraries > communicate. > > I’ve been involved with Evergreen, us a user and then as a consortium > leader, since 2015, and these recent discussion have been incredibly > illuminating. I feel privileged to be a part of this community. > > > Scott > > > > > > *From:* Open-ils-general [mailto:open-ils-general- > boun...@list.georgialibraries.org] *On Behalf Of *Kathy Lussier > *Sent:* Friday, March 30, 2018 10:46 AM > *To:* open-ils-general@list.georgialibraries.org > *Subject:* Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client > > > > Hi, > > In regards to this question: > > What can we do to get this fixed in 3.2 if not sooner? > > And the responses thus far: > > 1. Fix it yourself. > > 2. Hire someone else to fix it. > > 3. Wait for someone else to do 1 or 2. > > #4: work together to get it fixed (i.e. funding through development > partnerships) > > I also would like to talk about the role of positive advocacy in getting > attention on particular bugs, which may not guarantee that they get fixed, > but certainly could draw enough developer attention towards the bug to > result in it getting fixed. I guess this is really another spin on Jason's > solution #3 - wait for someone else to do 1 or 2. > > What exactly is positive advocacy? It's raising discussion on the lists, > just as we did here, to ask about a bug and to see if it also has an impact > on other Evergreen sites. It involves participating in LP discussions or > raising questions in IRC. It not only involves discussing why the bug is > important, but contributing to discussions on the best approach to fix it. > In the case of this particular bug, for example, there was discussion of > adding a "show empty libraries" option and a question of whether it should > replace the "show empty volumes" option or not. Getting feedback on > questions like this is very helpful. If a developer decides to take on the > bug, it will give them a clear direction for moving forward. Positive > advocacy also includes committing to test a fix when it is available. > > On a related side note, that Sandbox request form we use for Bug Squashing > Day is never turned off. If you ever want to test a bug fix when it's not > Bug Squashing Day, feel free to submit it or contact me directly. If I have > the a server and the time, I'm happy to load fixes so that people can help > with getting that bug fix merged to Evergreen. It's available at > https://goo.gl/forms/PE4fYfWDh5AixYpy2 > > I use the word 'positive' because I do think there is a thin line between > advocating that *we* as a community work together to fix a bug and > treating the community as a *they *that should be fixing a given bug or > introducing a new feature. FWIW, I am not saying that Scott was doing this > when he raised his question. Given the amount of sponsored development that > has come for both enhancements and bug fixes from PaILS, it's clear that he > already recognizes his organization's role in contributing to the > improvement of Evergreen. In general, though, I have seen this sentiment in > other discussions, and, as frustrating as it can be when you're dealing > with a problematic bug, we have to keep in mind that we're all on this > together. The more people who take on the responsibility of helping improve > Evergreen in some small or even large way, the better the software will be > for all of our users. > > I'm guessing that part of the original question really related to how > positive advocacy turns into an actual bug fix. With the release of 3.1, I > think we're all seeing that 3.2, when the xul client will no longer be > available for our users, is just around the corner. Although the web client > has come a long way, I think it's natural that there is some anxiety over > remaining bugs that are preventing staff from using the new client or > making it difficult for them to use it. > > Based on my observations over the past eight years, I would say all of the > following are factors in whether a bug gets fixed through these community > channels. > > Does the bug break critical functionality? For example, you can't build > the software, bib records can no longer be saved, you can no longer perform > checkouts. Generally, these are the types of bugs that get High priority in > Launchpad and are fixed very quickly. > > Is there a developer capable of fixing a bug who has the time to work on > it or are they in the middle of some other large project, like a migration? > > How long will it take to fix the bug? Is it a complex or easy fix? > https://bugs.launchpad.net/evergreen/+bug/1187993 has been a > high-priority bug for five years now, but it's complex and will take many > developer hours to fix. It's more difficult to get large fixes done without > asking a developer in your own organization to fix it or funding the fix. > Sometimes, low priority bugs get fixed simply because they're quick and > easy and more people may be capable of fixing it. > > Does the developer believe it will also affect the people in their own > organization? In organizations that have a developer, the positive advocacy > may be the thing that brings it to the attention of some cataloger or circ > person who then communicates to their developer that it is indeed a > critical issue. If the problem is related to serials and the developer > works at a library that doesn't use serials, they are less likely to work > on it. > > Think of it in terms of volunteering that you may do in your own home > communities. If somebody asks you to bake something for a bake sale to > raise funds for a cause you believe in, you may quickly say yes without a > thought. If they ask you to organize the bake sale, the answer may depend > on whether you have time or on how strongly you feel about the cause. If > you don't care about the cause at all (i.e. you can't understand why anyone > would ever want Evergreen to work that way), you may never say yes no > matter how much time you have. If the fundraiser is actually a capital > campaign project for a new library, it doesn't matter how many people feel > strongly about the issue, you may still need to hire a professional > fundraiser to organize the campaign for you. > > No matter how much positive advocacy I personally do for specific bugs, in > the end, I know if the MassLNC organizations feel strongly about a bug fix > or feature, we need to be prepared to fund it or have one of our internal > developers work on it. There are times when I've gritted my teeth while > funding a project, either because I think the software should just work > that way or because I feel like we've already invested enough into the > feature. However, I also know we are also indebted to many developers in > this community who have quickly fixed issues, both large and small, as a > result of our positive advocacy. In the end, it all balances out. > > Kathy > > > > > > On 03/29/2018 02:02 PM, scott.tho...@sparkpa.org wrote: > > Jason, > > Thank you for this information. Regarding this particular bug, it is too > serious to leave to #3, and we don't have the wherewithal to do #1 so we may > try to do #2...but will likely need funding partners...which brings us to #4: > work together to get it fixed. > > > > Scott > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Open-ils-general > [mailto:open-ils-general-boun...@list.georgialibraries.org > <open-ils-general-boun...@list.georgialibraries.org>] On Behalf Of Jason > Stephenson > > Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2018 1:44 PM > > To: open-ils-general@list.georgialibraries.org > > Subject: Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client > > > > On 03/29/2018 11:27 AM, scott.tho...@sparkpa.org wrote: > > I agree this is an impediment to implementing the Web Client in > > centralized or semi-centralized cataloging departments (of which we > > have many). I am just not conversant on the ins & outs of how to get > > fixes into a release versus a maintenance release versus a patch > > > > Bug targeting is done by one of the members of the drivers group. It is > usually done only for bugs that have patches or where someone is working on > it and is likely to have a patch ready in time for the release. We (mostly I) > sometimes break the unwritten rules and target bugs prematurely. > > > > As for how to get specific bugs fixed, you basically have 3 options: > > > > 1. Fix it yourself. > > 2. Hire someone else to fix it. > > 3. Wait for someone else to do 1 or 2. > > > > HtH, > > Jason > > > > > > -- > > Kathy Lussier > > Project Coordinator > > Massachusetts Library Network Cooperative > > (508) 343-0128 > > kluss...@masslnc.org > > Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/kmlussier > >
