On Wed, 12 Oct 2016, Clint Byrum wrote:

So, while I do want to make sure enough of our architects and designers
go to the summit to truly understand user needs, I also think it has
been proven ineffective to also throw all of the coders into that mix and
expect them to be productive.

I suspect you didn't mean it to sound like this, and I don't want to
distract overmuch from the meat of this thread, but at a superficial
level it appears you are implying that there is a disjunction
between coders and architects/designers. I was pretty sure that was
an antiquated notion and if it is being used to drive the decisions
about what should happen at summit and what should happen at PTG,
that's a shame.

The reason, as I understood it, for having a separate event is not
because all those users are such a horrible distraction but because
the sales and marketing efforts are (inherent in themselves and also
in the way that the corporate patrons want the devs to participate
in those efforts at the cost of the design summit-ing).

For most of us, as Dmitry points out, getting to summit even once a
year is a real challenge. Getting to 4 events, which is what will be
required to maintain full engagement with both the planning and
development of a project (not to mention cross project concerns), will
either be impossible or require a significant change in the financial
commitment that the patron companies are making. I think we'd all like
to see that change, but I think we all also know that it's not very likely
at this time.

That leaves us in a bit of a bind. It feels very much like we are
narrowing the direct feedback pipeline between operators and users. It
also feels like we are strengthening distinctions between various
types of contributors, based mostly on the economic power their
corporate patrons are willing to wield for them. And finally it
feels like we are making it harder for more people to be engaged in
cross project work.

I'm certain that none of these things are the desired outcomes.
What can we do to clarify the situation and remedy the issues?

Chris Dent               ┬─┬ノ( º _ ºノ)        https://anticdent.org/
freenode: cdent                                         tw: @anticdent
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