Hi Adi, Glad to help. Sadly no I'm not going to Stockholm.
On Thu, May 9, 2019, 5:13 AM Adrian Doyle <[email protected]> wrote: > Hi Sharon. Thanks for this. Ps will you be at Stockholm,? > > Get Outlook for Android <https://aka.ms/ghei36> > > ------------------------------ > *From:* [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf > of Sharon Penton <[email protected]> > *Sent:* Wednesday, May 8, 2019 6:01:48 PM > *To:* [email protected] > *Subject:* Re: [pestlist] Freeze once or freeze twice? > > Hi Adrian, > > I have had to deal with the pesty termites since coming back to the > states. Though I've only treated a few objects I had success with both > freezing at -30 and with using a CO2 bubble for 21 days. It's been over a > year now and nothing has re-emerged. One of these was the actually shipping > crate an object came in (the object was metal and glass thankfully but the > crate was left in storage!) so it had to go in the CO2 bubble due to its > size. > > Hope that helps and thanks to everyone for providing your views on the the > freeze once or twice question! > > Sharon Penton > > On Tue, May 7, 2019 at 9:54 AM Adrian Doyle <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> Dear all >> >> >> >> For a standard to ensure the temperature is the correct level, we have a >> variety of boxes which have packaging material, a wooden blockn with a hole >> to take a temperature probe as a guide to the object temperature. >> >> >> >> Where possible, the probe is put in the object or at least in the centre >> of a wrapped pack. >> >> >> >> Another question >> >> >> >> Does anyone have specific information or recommendation on treatment >> times/temperatures for termites? >> >> >> >> We don’t have termites here in the UK but have had a request for advice >> for material coming into the UK and we have no experience here >> >> >> >> Are they killed at standard treatments and how effective is anoxia using >> C02. >> >> Do they need the ‘shock treatment’ ie suddenly plunged into a freezer >> >> >> >> Any advice would be appreciated >> >> Adie Doyle >> >> >> >> Mr Adrian (Adie) Doyle >> >> Integrated Pest Management Manager >> >> British Museum >> >> Property & Facilities Management >> >> Great Russell Street, >> >> London WC1B 3DG >> >> >> >> Tel: 020 7323 8207 >> >> Mobile 07813 363292 >> >> Also available by Radio >> >> >> >> Email: [email protected] >> >> >> >> *The British Museum* >> >> Great Russell Street, London WC1B 3DG >> >> britishmuseum.org <http://www.britishmuseum.org/> >> >> >> >> *The security classification for this message is OFFICIAL* >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> *From:* [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] *On >> Behalf Of *Angelica Isa-Adaniya >> *Sent:* 03 May 2019 20:54 >> *To:* [email protected] >> *Subject:* Re: [pestlist] Freeze once or freeze twice? >> >> >> >> Hi Gretchen, >> >> >> >> No, it is not self-defrosting. In fact, the frost builds up on the walls >> a bit so that I have put some foam there to protect the bagged items from >> it, and I make sure to manually defrost and clean it whenever it is empty >> so that the ice does not build up over time. >> >> >> >> I do an immediate freeze from room temperature to -30ºC and then allow >> objects to defrost at room temperature for at least a day before opening >> the bag. There have been times when I was busy and left the bag sealed on >> the lab bench for a good week or so, only to find fresh frass and even live >> larvae when I finally got round to inspecting. I saw no holes in the bag to >> suggest a new, external infestation. So as Rich said, I say this based on >> personal experience, not controlled experiments. >> >> >> >> I'm aware it doesn't seem to make sense and that the articles and theory >> don't necessarily support it, but what can I say. This is what we see with >> T. herbarius here, which is not a beetle that shows up on the literature as >> far as I have found. As others have mentioned regarding odd beetles being >> seemingly resistant as opposed to other beetles, I can only imagine this is >> a similar case where T. herbarius happens to be particularly resilient. I >> hope none of you ever get it where you work because it is a nightmare of a >> beetle! >> >> >> >> Thank you all for the input and information. It's really helpful! >> >> >> >> Angelica >> >> >> >> On Fri, 3 May 2019 at 14:18, Anderson, Gretchen < >> [email protected]> wrote: >> >> Angelica, >> >> Is your freezer self-defrosting? A self-defrosting freezer defrosts by >> raising the temperature, thus creating a cycle of warming and cooling – >> this can affect the kill rates. >> >> >> >> Research over the past 30 (+) years has demonstrated that a double freeze >> is not necessary to achieve the kill rate. The more often you freeze the >> more likely the pests are to develop anti-freeze tendencies – actually you >> are mimicking natural freeze thaw cycles. In general, we feel that a fast >> freeze (do not cool down the objects in a refrigerator) and a slow thaw is >> best. The critical temperature is – 20 C, but you can go colder (See Tom >> Strang articles). Once the object is in the freezer, leave it there for >> longer than you think necessary (if you can). The other key factor is to >> double bag items. This will significantly reduce moisture loss. >> >> >> >> There was research some years ago out of Sweden about freezing as pest >> control. Preliminary findings were that even if eggs hatched after being >> frozen – but the DNA seemed to be damaged, and Gretchen Anderson >> >> Conservator >> >> Carnegie Museum of Natural History. >> >> >> >> *From:* [email protected] <[email protected]> *On Behalf >> Of *Angelica Isa-Adaniya >> *Sent:* Friday, May 3, 2019 2:40 PM >> *To:* [email protected] >> *Subject:* Re: [pestlist] Freeze once or freeze twice? >> >> >> >> I have also had to re-freeze (not very dense) objects infested with >> Tricorynus herbarius beetles even though I keep things in the freezer at >> -30ºC for up to 3 weeks, and I always place objects in directly into the >> -30ºC temperature. 😐 >> >> >> >> During the episode I told you about last year where the beetles were >> making their way into the freezer, they always woke up within about 10mins >> when I pulled them out for examination. Obviously, I don't know how long >> they had been in there before I pulled them out, so it could have been just >> a short time, but I don't take chances with these anymore. >> >> >> >> I guess some of these insects are just crazy resistant? >> >> >> >> - Angelica >> >> >> >> On Fri, 3 May 2019 at 11:33, Pollack, Richard J < >> [email protected]> wrote: >> >> Todd, >> >> >> >> Generally, the faster the temperature drops, the more likely the pests >> will succumb. Many cold-hearty arthropods will, indeed, modify the >> osmolality if their hemolymph, and there may be intracellular protective >> strategies that offer protection from ice crystal formation and >> resultant tissue damage. Slowly chilling some of these arthropods can >> induce the physiological changes. Hence, a rapid freeze is often most >> successful in causing the demise of the target pests. >> >> >> >> In the case I mentioned earlier, we believe that odd beetle eggs may be >> more freeze tolerant then the eggs of other pests. This belief is based on >> observations and experience (failure from a single freeze/thaw events), >> rather than carefully-crafted laboratory studies. Whereas the lab studies >> would be preferable, independent observations here suffice (for now) to >> convince us that a the second freeze/thaw cycle seems justified. >> >> >> >> I'd encourage others to provide data or their own observations, as those >> might serve to modify our recommendations. >> >> >> >> -Rich >> >> >> >> *Richard J. Pollack, PhD* >> >> *HARVARD UNIVERSITY* >> Environmental Health and Safety (EH&S) >> Senior Environmental Public Health Officer >> 46 Blackstone St. >> Cambridge, MA 02139 >> *Office*: 617-495-2995 *Cell*: 617-447-0763 >> www.ehs.harvard.edu >> >> [email protected] >> >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> *From:* [email protected] <[email protected]> on behalf >> of Todd Holmberg <[email protected]> >> *Sent:* Friday, May 3, 2019 12:01 PM >> *To:* [email protected] >> *Subject:* Re: [pestlist] Freeze once or freeze twice? >> >> >> >> For the group that believes a second freezing is necessary, is it because >> of how some insects can apparently create some sort of internal antifreeze >> like material that can allow them to come back to life after being frozen? >> The second freeze then kind of "catches them by surprise" in a way as >> they are unthawing thinking "winter is over". (Is that the general theory?) >> >> >> >> I have been told that as long as the freezer temp is already at -30 when >> the object is placed inside, the rate that the object cools down is rapid >> enough to prevent insects from protecting themselves with the antifreeze. >> >> >> >> Hypothetically, if you are freezing wood that is pretty thick/dense, and >> wood boring beetles had burrowed deep into the object near the >> center, could the thickness of the wood give those insects near the >> center a little extra time to protect themselves? Would this type of >> scenario benefit from a "double freeze"? >> >> >> >> -Todd >> >> >> >> On Fri, May 3, 2019 at 9:29 AM Voron, Joel <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> At -30 for 72 hours once is sufficient to kill all life stages of pests. >> JTV >> >> >> >> >> >> *Joel Voron Colonial Williamsburg Foundation* >> >> Conservation Dept. >> >> Integrated Pest Management >> >> Office 757-220-7080 >> >> Cell 757-634-1175 >> >> E-Mail [email protected] >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On May 3, 2019, at 8:52 AM, Adrian Doyle <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >> Dear all >> >> Double freezing shouldn’t be necessary so long as the core temperature of >> the object is at the correct temperature for the correct time >> >> Adie >> >> >> >> Mr Adrian (Adie) Doyle >> >> Integrated Pest Management Manager >> >> British Museum >> >> Property & Facilities Management >> >> Great Russell Street, >> >> London WC1B 3DG >> >> >> >> Tel: 020 7323 8207 >> >> Mobile 07813 363292 >> >> Also available by Radio >> >> >> >> Email: [email protected] >> >> >> >> *The British Museum* >> >> Great Russell Street, London WC1B 3DG >> >> britishmuseum.org >> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.britishmuseum.org_&d=DwMFaQ&c=WO-RGvefibhHBZq3fL85hQ&r=GO7C3XN3WgFy2IP-bFBbnUs_CYntqj57Dprtl40-_KE&m=HYc5B0R7euCxciXPUyhUN5Yp7PDC_pFjrS93rADVcRk&s=cOs2Cw5IGmVLWGTh6JqzlMKPhJAPJgeKrViPED0kNGM&e=> >> >> >> >> *The security classification for this message is OFFICIAL* >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> *From:* [email protected] [mailto:[email protected] >> <[email protected]>] *On Behalf Of *Sharon Penton >> *Sent:* 03 May 2019 13:51 >> *To:* [email protected] >> *Subject:* [pestlist] Freeze once or freeze twice? >> >> >> >> Good morning all, >> >> >> >> Some of my colleagues are adamant about freezing collection twice when >> dealing with pest. They freeze a first time then let everything get back to >> room temperature for a day or so then freeze again. Is this common >> practice? I've always thought if we can achieve a reliable -30 that should >> take care of all adults larvae and eggs? >> >> Would someone mind weighing in? >> >> Thanks! >> >> Sharon >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Museumpests" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. >> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/pestlist >> <https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__groups.google.com_group_pestlist&d=DwMFaQ&c=WO-RGvefibhHBZq3fL85hQ&r=GO7C3XN3WgFy2IP-bFBbnUs_CYntqj57Dprtl40-_KE&m=HYc5B0R7euCxciXPUyhUN5Yp7PDC_pFjrS93rADVcRk&s=pgLORCbA5vlzLkPV9KAO_R8b5FphuyxKDUTEU80TUTA&e=> >> . >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/pestlist/CALWceqtcq04tuBmBQP0uvpFfmNezUsXoCdFkWH4YMc%3DDYTP3KQ%40mail.gmail.com >> 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