Dear David and Stephane, Thank you for your replies. David, you make excellent points. I did not know about VW being free and will try it out. And you're certainly right that however much Smalltalk web resources are smaller than Python's, it is certainly a much better environment for learning Smalltalk now than it was 20 years ago.
And Stephane, I say 'your' and not 'our' because if my wife found out I got involved in yet another cause on the web, she'd kill me! And also, I can't code in Smalltalk, so I'm very much a spectator. But I did not intend for my original post to be negative. I absolutely believe Pharo is 100% on the right track, and a critical component in a potential Smalltalk resurgence. So I'll keep waiting, and when 1.0 comes out, I'll give it a try again. Kind regards, Robert David Mitchell-6 wrote: > > Sorry, I think my intent got lost in my joy for nostalgia. > > There was a big Smalltalk party but it ended. Then it was quiet for a > while (but the party was underground). > > Now, the party is getting started again. > > You may just be a little early coming to the second party. > > Things you have today that I didn't have in 1994: > You can download (Pharo, GNU Smalltalk, Squeak and use it however you > like). > There are two free, open source, and maintained cross dialect web > frameworks: Seaside and AidaWeb (we wrote our own and it paled in > comparison) > You can use Gemstone for free for small sites. > You can use Magma as a free OODB. > You can use VW for non-commercial (including to learn Smalltalk). > The Squeak list exists. (All I had was comp.lang.smalltalk). > Many good Smalltalk blogs. > Almost all of the old Smalltalk books are available free as PDF. > Many of the new Smalltalk books are available free and from Lulu. > Most of the classics can still be bought used on Amazon. > James Roberson's smalltalk podcasts. > James Robertson's nearly daily Smalltalk screencasts. > Randal Schwartz promoting Smalltalk > squeak irc channel > > > On Thu, Jul 9, 2009 at 1:46 PM, Robert Peters<[email protected]> > wrote: >> >> Yes, you're quite right, David. But my point is that my particular >> situation >> is representative of everyone who is not currently in the Smalltalk >> community. I posted because I want the Smalltalk community to grow, but >> it's peak has passed. There are no SUGs, there is no Smalltalk magazine, >> there are no web resources. And the Smalltalk community must grow if it >> is >> to be taken seriously. >> >> I cannot go back in time and learn it in the 'peak'. I must learn it >> now, >> with the resources that are available now. These resources are lacking. >> >> If a person was equally proficient in Smalltalk and Python, which would >> they >> produce better code faster in? >> >> I suspect the answer may be Smalltalk, because of its one, beautiful, >> paradigm. But I, and millions like me, will never know. >> >> I'm hoping Pharo will be the first steps in changing that. >> >> Kind regards, >> Robert >> >> >> David Mitchell-6 wrote: >>> >>> I would insert the phrase "for you" several times into your post. That >>> is, is Python a better language (for me) at this time. Or, was Python >>> an easier language (for me) to learn than Smalltalk. >>> >>> If you come late enough to the party (and the party is large enough), >>> you can Google for all your answers. Smalltalk's popularity spiked in >>> the early 90s (until Java popped its bubble). You couldn't Google for >>> Smalltalk answers then largely due to the lack of Google ;-). >>> >>> >> >> -- >> View this message in context: >> http://n2.nabble.com/Squeak-Forks-Popularity---Trends-Estimate-tp3211130p3233384.html >> Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pharo-project mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project >> > > _______________________________________________ > Pharo-project mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project > > -- View this message in context: http://n2.nabble.com/Squeak-Forks-Popularity---Trends-Estimate-tp3211130p3233978.html Sent from the Pharo Smalltalk mailing list archive at Nabble.com. _______________________________________________ Pharo-project mailing list [email protected] http://lists.gforge.inria.fr/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pharo-project
