> -----Original Message-----
> From: tedd [mailto:tedd.sperl...@gmail.com] 
> Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2010 9:06 AM
> To: Daevid Vincent; php-general@lists.php.net
> Subject: RE: [PHP] In need of CVS/SVN checkout script for 
> Production servers [solved]
> At 5:43 PM -0700 5/5/10, Daevid Vincent wrote:
> >  > -----Original Message-----
> >  > From: tedd [mailto:tedd.sperl...@gmail.com]
> >  > Sent: Wednesday, May 05, 2010 8:19 AM
> >  > To: Daevid Vincent; php-general@lists.php.net
> >  > Subject: RE: [PHP] In need of CVS/SVN checkout script for
> >  >-snip- stuff which fell on deaf ears
> >  >
> >  > tedd
> >
> >*sigh* once again you people focus on something SOOOO off 
> topic compared to
> >the meat of the thread -- which is a production repository 
> checkout script.
> Let me get this right -- you created a repository for people to 
> check-out/deposit scripts, but then deny some people access because 
> of their choice of browser? That seems counter productive. Do your 
> scripts only work for certain browsers?

No. I created a little miniscule dumping ground for some useful scripts *I*
use, and if someone else can use them, then feel free. I don't support
them. I don't even pretend to maintain them once posted. They are what they

> ---------------
> >As for my site.
> >
> >[*] I really don't care about the fringe browsers...
> That obvious. But what happens when your client's do care?

I make 6+ figures and have so for years. I'm not a freelancer. My
experience, networking and resume get me jobs, not my home page. I don't
have "clients".

> ---------------
> >     Give me a break man. I've got more important things to do.
> Let me get this right --  it's more important to do something else 
> than to fix something you did wrong? If you're gong to take the time 
> to do something, then why not do it right? Remember, this is an 
> example of *your* work.

No. Examples of my "work" are what I get PAID for. This is simply a
personal page and a "hobby".

> I spend a lot of my time making my code as good as I can get it, not 
> because of clients, or what others might think, but because of me. 
> It's a personal choice of mine to always learn and improve. If you 
> allow "I've got more important things to do" altitude to excuse bad 
> code, then you are only hurting yourself in the long run. I think you 
> know that.
> ---------------
> >[*] Honestly, I also dislike Apple. I think it's stupid for 
> them to make a
> >browser. I think they make crappy products.
> LOL!
> So you think that M$ makes better stuff, like IE6? Even Apple's worst 
> browser was better than that!

Yes I do. I won't get into an OS war with you though.

XP is the best OS thus far. Everything in the world supports it. It is
stable and fast. 

As for browser, I use FF for developing (mostly for Firebug) and some
flavor of IE (usually all three to test with) as that is what most people
still use. IE6 is still the standard default browser Panasonic uses (that's
5000 users alone). Many other large enterprise companies also stick with
XP/IE6. Only slowly are they migrating to IE8.

> ---------------
> >As for CSS, inline styles, separation of logic, and all that 
> other stuff
> >you ASSUME I don't use -- you are very wrong. I just happen 
> to use a lot of
> >PHP to dynamically create various parts.
> I'm not ASSUMING anything -- it's a fact the site you provided 
> doesn't follow said practices.
> Additionally, you seem to be blaming PHP for the bad code but the 
> fact is you're just being lazy. Many of my sites are dynamically 
> created via PHP but still generate good code. One doesn't exclude the 
> other.

Not blaming at all. Just saying that while you see "inline" JS or CSS, it's
actually not as it appears. Some of that is generated in routines or loops.

> The point is that you want us to go to your site to check-out/provide 
> scripts, but the site you provided reeks of bad code. That's a bit 
> like a dinner saying "Don't mind the dirty silverware, just eat the 
> food."

No. I don't "want" you to do anything. I offered up some free code. Take it
or leave it. If you want it, then the least you can do is use the required
browsers (which mostly everyone has already installed) to get to it. In
fact, if you're such a die-hard Safari user, just change your USER_AGENT
string and it will probably work. No sweat off my balls if you don't.

> ---------------
> >In some cases I inline styles where they are used one time or used 
> >in a PHP function.
> Okay, then why not learn how to do it right? Using a validator can 
> help you improve your code. Standards are not just for an elite group 
> of people but rather to improve overall coding practices. What's 
> wrong with that? Validation is giving you the opportunity to 
> critically review your code.

What part about "coded 4 years ago" don't you understand?

> ---------------
> >If I had to choose between my
> >daevid.com site and one of the three you (presumably) 
> illustrate as beacons
> >of "the way to do it" (http://sperling.com  http://ancientstones.com
> >http://earthstones.com), then I would take my site any day 
> of the week.
> Go ahead -- but many people won't -- as shown by your site's NULL 
> Google PageRank.

Again, you seem to think I give a flying fig about my PERSONAL PAGE

In fact, I'm happy to have it live in obscurity and only for those that I
want to see it as it has some personal information, it keeps me under the
radar of hackers, and it allows me to share with friends and family without
exposing too much to the world.

Your numbers are mistaken:
Sperling.com is 5/10
Daevid.com is a 2/10 
Ancientstones.com is 2/10
Earthstones.com is 2/10

And Alexa ranks:

   143,591 http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/sperling.com
 6,093,223 http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/daevid.com
 7,424,118 http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/earthstones.com
16,097,191 http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/ancientstones.com

So people in glass houses shouldn't throw stones -- Ancient or Earthen...

(And I'll even say congratulations on that sperling.com ranking. It's
impressive to be that low.)

> At least my sites have traffic. For example, according to today's 
> Google Analyitics report during the last 30 days my sperling.com site 
> has received 5970 unique visitors -- I'll take *that* any day of the 
> week over shutting people out.

Again. Don't care how many visitors I get to my personal site. I'm not
selling ad banners, so all visitors do is bog down my server and bandwidth.
If I could restrict traffic to ONLY those I wanted to see it, I would.

> Daevid -- after all is said and done, I know you are better than 
> this. I'm not sure why you are arguing the point.

I'm not sure either. In fact, you're right. I *am* better than this. And
for the same reasons I won't bother to update my personal site anytime soon
for 10% of the entire fringe browser market, I have more important things
to do with my time -- like my day job or spend it with my family and

> Cheers,
> tedd

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